Interviewer: Uh first of all first will give you me the date 027: #1 {X} July thirteenth # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: nineteen seventy-one Interviewer: uh and the uh and the uh and this community 027: Maryville Tennessee Interviewer: All right and the county 027: Blount County Interviewer: and your full name 027: {B} Interviewer: what's the 027: Pflanze Interviewer: and what is that the 027: German Interviewer: uh-huh 027: it means plant Interviewer: uh-huh yes that a was that a uh uh given name 027: #1 that is my father's that's my family name # Interviewer: #2 {X} or a that's your father's family name huh # and you're address 027: um my mailing address is {B} Maryville Tennessee my address my residence is {B} Maryville Tennessee Interviewer: #1 you mail to a different address and I see # 027: #2 uh-huh we pick up our mail downtown at the post office # Interviewer: well that's something that you'd get from the wouldn't that be one of the fringe benefits of the 027: now we've always done that because of uh Bill works you see his business and his name are the same Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and they got our mail so confused that uh we ever since we've had a home of our own we've gotten all our mail in town and then sorted it out they do deliver mail out Interviewer: #1 uh-huh uh-huh # 027: #2 we have a rural delivery we have rural rout out here # Interviewer: and your birth place 027: Maryville Interviewer: #1 Tennessee # 027: #2 where you born right in the # uh Yes I can show you the little house out on Sevierville Road which is still standing I assume it was in the city limits then it is now Interviewer: is that how it's pronounced Sevierville 027: #1 yes it's uh for John no for John Sevier # Interviewer: #2 I call it Sevierville # uh-huh 027: who was the governor of Tennessee and a famed frontiersman Interviewer: #1 uh-huh I seen that uh {X} # 027: #2 uh-huh town # #1 Sevierville and this road goes there from here # Interviewer: #2 uh yeah # I see and was that in the um uh was that in the city limits uh or in the 027: I think it was in the city limits when I was born we lived there just four months they were building a house when I was born uh because I couldn't stand the noise in the little house Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and when I was four months old we moved to Goddard Street in Maryville Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 where I lived # until I married And where my mother lived until she died last year did you live then in you lived in the Interviewer: #1 in the in the uh city of Maryville and all your life # 027: #2 in town yes uh # huh Interviewer: uh and your age 027: oh fifty-one Interviewer: alright and you religion 027: Presbyterian Interviewer: and do you have any occupation of any kind now 027: house wife Interviewer: ok and but you're well that's an occupation but did you have uh you did other 027: uh yes when uh I by the time I finished college Bill was in service over sees and we were planning to be married so I went to work so I could help support my husband while he finished school Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and uh then of course I intended to work after we were married and I worked for TBA as a clerk typist and did legal work because he was going to law school and I was terminated in the big termination of nineteen and forty-seven I guess I was the number one employee to be terminated Interviewer: #1 huh # 027: #2 I had uh # Interviewer: #1 none of the qualifications for staying # 027: #2 well at least oh # Interviewer: #1 and was it seniority or uh # 027: #2 and uh # seniority union membership union participation uh veteran status and disabled veteran Interviewer: uh-huh 027: That I had least seniority and I had not joined the union Interviewer: #1 {NW} # 027: #2 and {X} that # took care of that very neatly and then I came to uh Maryville and worked uh as a book keeper and paymaster at the Maryville electric system for a year and in order to do that I had to go to UT to night school and take book keeping Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and I came over that precisely half the salary I had been earning just the month Interviewer: #1 is that right # 027: #2 before at TBA uh-huh # Interviewer: is that right 027: #1 but in that # Interviewer: #2 you got to go to school # in order to make half the salary 027: #1 yeah uh-huh Bill # Interviewer: #2 {X} that's great # 027: it was very neat Bill the day he took his final exam at law school and uh was uh relieved of his GI bill benefits was the same day I was terminated So we finished with a clean slate and started practicing law {NW} Interviewer: Now Then after that I went to work for him 027: #1 as his secretary # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # and that's the only those 027: #1 those are my # Interviewer: #2 yeah # 027: #1 complete occupations # Interviewer: #2 okay alright # Now your um uh your education what uh they did you go to the same you I suppose you went to attended the same elementary school all the way through 027: #1 Um # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: yes except that I was ill a great deal and I was tutored at home Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 more actually than # than I went to school but the teachers came and gave me the exams Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and so I was uh an enrolled student Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and I did have the qualifications I went to West Side Elementary School Maryville Junior High Maryville High School then I went two years to Sullins College and finished at the University of Tennessee Interviewer: #1 Where is this # 027: #2 Sullins in # Bristol Virginia Interviewer: uh-huh and the what is the Maryville the Mary is the college here in Maryville it's called Maryville College 027: #1 it's a Presbyterian # Interviewer: #2 what kind of a school is it # 027: #1 four year liberal arts uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 four year liberal arts school # uh my next door neighbor knew about them he he asked me what kind of school it was I said I remember seeing it 027: uh-huh Interviewer: when I I cus I came up I came the right way last 027: #1 {NW} # Interviewer: #2 {X} # to to Knoxville but I came through here but I didn't today um and you so you've what what about your your major in um in college was it 027: I majored in uh dramatic art and speech at Sullins and these credits all transferred as English credits and I had to take one course to have completed an English major at UT Interviewer: Oh I see 027: {NW} and so I did a minor in uh History of the South which I had to do to go with my English major and then I did my several other minors just for fun in sociology and psychology and botanyand anthropology Interviewer: uh-huh 027: what none of which counted towards my Interviewer: #1 did what year # 027: #2 major # Interviewer: now what year did you did you graduate from from college 027: um nineteen and forty-three in March Interviewer: alright and when did you graduate from high school was it four years #1 before that # 027: #2 no there's six years # Interviewer: #1 ok # 027: #2 I had # two years as a special student Interviewer: #1 alright # 027: #2 becuase # I had gone through a windshield Interviewer: o 027: and uh so I I went to Sullins from um thirty-seven to thirty-nine Interviewer: And then UT's{NS} as a special student from thirty-nine to forty-one and forty-one to forty-three 027: #1 {X} so both times two # Interviewer: #2 alright and when # when did you graduate from elementary school thirty-six then 027: um uh high school thirty-seven Interviewer: yeah 027: May of nineteen thirty-seven And so you graduate Interviewer: #1 in elementary school eight years # 027: #2 in # Interviewer: elementary school eight years 027: #1 uh # Interviewer: #2 and # 027: six years and in two years junior high Interviewer: #1 right # 027: #2 it was # then they now do it Interviewer: #1 yeah # 027: #2 differently # Interviewer: but I can just get the dates then going back 027: #1 yes # Interviewer: #2 two years from high school # the high the high school from 027: #1 thirty-seven and then # Interviewer: #2 {X} yeah # 027: thirty-nine Sullins and then forty-three UT Interviewer: okay fine now uh what just some general uh uh information about your social contacts your your close friends church business contacts what kind the kinds of people your your club would be great and you know just tell me the kinds of people that you uh associate with 027: uh well of course there are, most of our good friends seem to be professional people I suppose we're drawn together by our common interests and then my clubs uh there is the book club they're just twelve of us and uh this is just strictly on an interest in reading and we have one two three professors four professors and uh several of us are house wives and uh {B} is a very interesting person she is an artist uh who has taken this up in recent years her husband is both a lawyer and doctor He did law and then medicine Interviewer: uh-huh really 027: and um we call him our professional student Interviewer: uh-huh 027: uh then I'm also active Interviewer: #1 welcome for malpractice cases {NW} # 027: #2 in a sorority {NW} right we # had one joint meeting of the bar and the uh medical society I remember where they took their wives and they had Jack as a moderator Interviewer: #1 {NW} good # 027: #2 because he was retired # {NS} uh then I'm um active in my sorority in alumni work and uh until this last year had had a nice little office for Interviewer: huh 027: twenty years I guess something like that and that then of course the federated women's club Interviewer: huh 027: here in town Interviewer: that is that 027: #1 yes # Interviewer: #2 Kappa Delta # I think that was the first uh nat is that is that's the first of the national national sororities that came to Dekalb 027: #1 yes uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 I remember when that sorority # 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 they opened a chapter in Dekalb # 027: uh-huh Interviewer: that was when Northern just started to I think the TKE's came in as a fraternity and then Kappa Delta 027: yes I I can't remember exactly when that was but I remember that uh chapter Interviewer: uh-huh 027: quite well do where do you have your national meetings all over uh yes we we rotate in sections they had a meeting last week in Hot Springs Arkansas which I did not get to attend although I'd planned to and um our next one will be in Roanoke because that will be our Diamond Jubilee and we were founded in Virginia Interviewer: #1 did you ever in North Caroline recently # 027: #2 that will be two years from now # no uh we went to the Bahamas two years ago and uh let's see before that we went to Chicago New Orleans um Pasadena Biloxi uh Bedford, Pennsylvania I don't believe we've ever been to North Carolina Interviewer: #1 around Asheville either no # 027: #2 can't remember huh-uh # Interviewer: #1 cuz I thought my # 027: #2 It's hard to {X} # Interviewer: sister in law is the I thought that {X} I'm not certain what sorority she's in but uh she's very active in uh and she goes to the to the uh I know she goes to the I don't know what she other than going to conventions 027: #1 {NW} that's active {NW} that's very active # Interviewer: #2 but I don't yeah ok well # she does that and I do you have any uh uh connection with your church 027: #1 yes # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: and the women's association um I have had to be more inactive recently because I've had these accidents which kept me in but I still okay have an office in the circle I know longer have an office in the association and my most recent uh activity I guess was to make a poster Interviewer: huh 027: {NW} which Lee called yesterday to thank me for and then I I'm the last one that should have made a poster Interviewer: #1 {NW} # 027: #2 but it needed and so I made it {NW} # Interviewer: uh and did have you lived have you lived elsewhere and uh when I was in school of course and then Bill and I lived in Knoxville one year uh when he came back from the service and we had planned to live in Knoxville and we found that we're country people uh-huh did you marry uh before he went into the service 027: #1 no # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: we married when he came back Interviewer: I see so I see so that didn't his being in the service didn't 027: #1 no I was I was at # Interviewer: #2 didn't interfere with {X} # 027: home all that uh time uh and uh travel what um uh how much time have you spent traveling do you travel much um it doesn't seem like much to me but it probably is right much I've been um well of course the family used to take motor trips because this was the new thing driving in the car and I remember when I was a tiny little girl we went all the way to Niagara Falls and um on into Canada so that was one day of foreign travel Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 {NW} # and then Bill and I went to uh Mexico much the same way uh we went down and uh he was doing some work in southern Texas and then he has a {NS} sister {NS} that's all right As long as I can hear it that's uh Interviewer: #1 uh # 027: #2 {NW} # Interviewer: that's all now uh have you taken any any other do you do you take vacations usually every year uh o now and then there were often fishing vacations we did take a cruise several years ago and um we went to the Bahamas to the that was my convention and Bill's 027: #1 fishing trip that year # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh uh-huh # 027: and uh we usually work it in actually with something uh that Bill wants to do Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 a fishing # trip or we take several trips and visit our first bred relatives Interviewer: uh-huh now where are they 027: uh Bill's sister is in Santa Feand his brother is in Baytown Texas and my family's in Atlanta Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and uh we have aunts here there and beyond Interviewer: does your family uh does uh see your family's in Atlanta are these 027: my sister and her children Interviewer: uh-huh and how many children were there in your family 027: the two of us Interviewer: #1 your and your sister and your sister's uh # 027: #2 {X} # Interviewer: um 027: Sissy's mother Interviewer: uh-huh was she born in Atlanta Sissy born in 027: #1 No # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: She was born in Sylva North Carolina Interviewer: o because 027: and moved to Marietta when she was two I Interviewer: #1 I see # 027: #2 guess # and then from Marietta to Interviewer: #1 I wondered # 027: #2 Atlanta # Interviewer: because she said cuz it's she came over to my office one day with uh several people from Georgia State and she just mentioned and she said if you ever you know if you go up to well if you're gonna cus I told her I'm gonna be up in eastern Tennessee and she mentioned it I was wondering if she'd you know she'd been born here 027: No but uh they were here of course cuz her grandmother was here Interviewer: uh-huh 027: often Interviewer: Now in the did uh in the uh one other thing about the clubs and so forth and the church did you have what formal offices did you hold for instance the sorority and 027: nationally Interviewer: yeah oh I was a providence president I was national press director I was editor of the Katie Did It which was the um pictorial section of the {X} our national publication seems that I did something else but I can't remember 027: #1 at the moment # Interviewer: #2 but what's a # providence is that a set of 027: #1 uh set of states it was # Interviewer: #2 states is that like # 027: #1 it was actually # Interviewer: #2 rebuilt # 027: Tennessee and Kentucky I had eight chapters Interviewer: uh-huh 027: that I had um immediate advisory supervision over Interviewer: I see now in the would you traveled said you traveled over couple of weeks uh uh so you how how many how many weeks out of uh uh uh ordinary year would you say you were away from Maryville 027: um uh breaking it into weekends I would say seven or eight weeks all totaled Interviewer: #1 and you say and most and most # 027: #2 that may be too much # Interviewer: of this is in uh fishing and then uh 027: fishing or visiting or uh shopping Interviewer: but never but you don't you don't go any place around for four or five weeks at a time another part of the country {X} 027: No my husband couldn't quite Interviewer: #1 {NW} # 027: #2 pick up that long # Interviewer: okay now where was your mother born 027: Maryville no Blount County I'm sorry Interviewer: where in Blount County in what part of Blount County 027: oh it's under Fort Loudoun Lake now it's uh was a farm known as the {X} place and um it's underwater I'm sure uh-huh Interviewer: Fort Loudoun Lake a product of TVA 027: #1 yes uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 I see # uh and where's your father born 027: Maryville Interviewer: In the in the town itself 027: I assume so I have his birth certificate some place but I'm sure that it Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 it was in town I don't think grandmother # and grandfather ever lived out of town Interviewer: what was his occupation you father's 027: he was a retail lumber dealer he was educated to be a lawyer and lost his hearing at the age of twenty-one when he was trying his first case Interviewer: is that right 027: so he um Interviewer: where'd he go to school Maryville College and the University of Tennessee and uh what your mother's occupation 027: #1 housewife # Interviewer: #2 and your mother's educ and # mother's education 027: Maryville College Interviewer: alright she had an interesting education she was one of seven children and grandfather was a farmer who uh at various time was chairman of the county court he was county judge when he died for one or two terms he was sheriff and they had seven surviving children and they had this problem of educating them and some years they sent them all to boarding school down to Friendsville Academy or up to Maryville College and some years they had a governess come and live on the farm and some years they just moved to town bought a house and lived in it during the school year and sent the children to school and then moved back down to the farm in the 027: #1 summer uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 is that right # {NW} interesting you're uh um mother's parents 027: #1 {X} # Interviewer: #2 birth # place education occupation 027: #1 Blount County Blount # Interviewer: #2 Just tell me # 027: County and Maryville College on back for several Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 generations # now my uh father's parents came from Germany grandfather uh when he was twenty-one we have his diary he came uh because he was dissatisfied with the political Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 situation # grandmother's family came and I don't know at what time her sister was married to grandfather but when aunt Louise died then her father brought down the next sister to marry the widower Interviewer: oh really {NW} 027: and uh so that is uh but she was twelve when her family came uh-huh from Germany they came from Mecklenburg Schwerin on the North Sea Interviewer: {X} 027: wherever they may be Interviewer: that's in Mecklenburg is that the same Mecklenburg that uh is used in Virginia are they German settlements in 027: I think so Interviewer: yeah Virginia um at what about the earlier ancestry on your mother's side 027: uh we haven't recorded back uh we're members of the D-A-R we a uh had several ancestors who were in the revolution they were McConnells Matthews McReynolds was her madden name and they were uh farmers Scotch-Irish and uh always very interesting education Interviewer: Virginia from Virginia they emigrated from Virginia or from #1 uh uh # 027: #2 they # came from Ireland Interviewer: #1 yeah # 027: #2 to # to um North Carolina into Tennessee Interviewer: well they came from 027: from Londonderry the the forth great back I believe Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 {X} # is buried in Londonderry Interviewer: uh-huh as we traced this on his 027: #1 papers # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # #1 {X} # 027: #2 and then # uh both uh both of her parents were born in Blount County both families were Interviewer: uh-huh 027: prominent large farm families Interviewer: uh what Londonderry are you talking about #1 Londonderry Ire Ireland alright okay so # 027: #2 Ireland # Interviewer: but did they what places in North Carolina do you uh associate 027: #1 I really don't # Interviewer: #2 with # 027: know except that James Matthews fought in the battle of King's Mountain Interviewer: heard that in a song {NW} uh I could look it up on my D-A-R 027: #1 {X} that's # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: all I know Interviewer: #1 that's uh # 027: #2 personally # Interviewer: that it one of the interesting things about uh uh uh uh Tennessee is is it uh the people I've interviewed is that they really have no you know that it's that they have no well they're always from Tennessee you know 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 I've got # so many people just that they just uh {D: so I so I always ask people say oh what} what nationality do you do you associate with yourself many of them say American but that isn't much help um how old is your husband 027: fifty-one Interviewer: and his religion he's 027: Presbyterian Interviewer: and his education 027: um primary in Meridian Mississippi and uh Maryville College and University of Tennessee Interviewer: #1 Where was he born # 027: #2 and law school # Birmingham Alabama He was born in Birmingham and then Interviewer: #1 educated # 027: #2 educated grew up in # Meridian Interviewer: is that right 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 um # what uh uh we'll come to that in a minute but now his I suppose his social contacts are much the same as yours with the exception of more in uh uh some additional business 027: #1 yes uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 contacts # would you say most of your friends are uh through these clubs or through your uh husband's business contacts or 027: just through living Interviewer: yeah 027: our um old school friends our neighbors from childhood our neighbors Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 that we # have lived near have lived near in the last twenty-five years that we've been married Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 and some # uh of course professional Interviewer: #1 right # 027: #2 uh friends # and but those people too turn out to be our neighbors Interviewer: #1 uh-huh yeah sure # 027: #2 and go to the same church and # the same clubs and what have you Interviewer: now he was born in Birmingham where were his uh parents born his father was born in Jefferson County Tennessee and mother was born in Knox County Tennessee his mother was a Beard and you came through Bearden this morning It is named for the the area is 027: #1 where her family's # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # 027: farm was Interviewer: is that on eleven or four eleven 027: on eleven Interviewer: uh-huh yeah I do remember that 027: uh-huh Interviewer: I thought I remembered but I 027: uh-huh Interviewer: and his uh what was his father's occupation he was a claim adjuster for Southern Railway he was earlier than that he was um with the commissioner of insurance for the state of Tennessee and with the internal he was a revenuer he told 027: #1 wonderful # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # 027: tales of going out Interviewer: #1 yeah uh-huh # 027: #2 in the mountains and so # forth and then for a time his first job I believe was in a bank in uh Dandridge Tennessee he was education Carson-Newman College Interviewer: and where's that 027: Jefferson Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 City # I think {NW} that's right know if that's right Interviewer: uh-huh {NS} and his ancestors then uh what how did he happen to to be to be in Mississippi I mean what The Southern Railway 027: #1 uh transferred him to # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: #1 to from Birmingham to # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # 027: #1 Meridian # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # but his originally was from 027: #1 Jefferson # Interviewer: #2 from {X} # 027: #1 County Tennessee # Interviewer: #2 Tennessee I see so that # okay 027: they sent the children back to Tennessee school is that right Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 uh-huh # Interviewer: and I think that uh that's it oh just would you just give me uh uh kind of off the cuff description uh with a little history uh so then of uh Maryville and also of its Alcoa which is interesting to me I I didn't realize and I didn't even think about the associating the company with the town 027: #1 oh the Alcoa # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: as far as I know was the first company built town Interviewer: uh-huh 027: it was built for housing for employees when they built the plant uh-huh and they Alcoa had no industry with the exception of a grocery store and a dry cleaner seems there was one other business out there until after World War Two and the company starts selling houses to those who wish to buy and up until then everyone had lived if they lived in Alcoa in a company owned house Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and then with private ownership of the property came business Interviewer: uh-huh 027: into the town Interviewer: I see what's the size of Al- is Alcoa now uh larger than uh Maryville 027: no we are larger I refer in my handy telephone book Interviewer: {NW} 027: which is brand new {NS} {NS} and has the uh {NS} if {NS}I can find it {NS} {NS} it has the populations in it Interviewer: I think it's in the back page {NS} in the Atlanta book anyway anyway {X} 027: #1 anywhere # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: no this is facts about Knoxville we have a joint book {NS} anyway we have about thirty-three thousand in the county and I'll about oh say {NS} eleven thousand's in Maryville and seven thousand's Alcoa something {NS} and the rest I would just {NS} {NS} heavy populated {NS} county {NS} {NS} Maryville was {NS} well it was {NS} in the seventeen hundreds {NS} it was Craig's Fort and McTEER's Fort and Henry's Henry's Henry's Fort and they were built of course uh they were wooden forts built uh for protection against the Indians by the settlers that came across the mountains and um New Providence Church where we attend was started two years before the town was um founded uh whatever the Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 legal procedure is # #1 for um # Interviewer: #2 {X} # when was that now that 027: it was seventeen and ninety something I believe it was long long ago and uh the college then came soon after the church Interviewer: oh as a seminary um 027: {X} church and New Providence Church and Maryville College were all started by the same Interviewer: #1 is that # 027: #2 um # Interviewer: Maryville {D: and the oldest chur} oldest oldest college in Tennessee probably 027: uh no UT is a little bit older it was it was Blount College Interviewer: oh 027: named for Willy Blount alright first governor of the territory and um I think that's I think UT is older I do have to check it but we we really go back right far for this part of the country Interviewer: is the Blount who is the postmaster uh related that is he a relative 027: #1 {X} # Interviewer: #2 I don't think so # 027: I don't think so I think {NS} we tried to uh see that he his but I don't believe he Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 is # 027: and Maryville was a country town it's still a country town a very small town uh College oriented {NS} and then in nineteen and uh eighteen nineteen twenty the aluminum company came and this brought big industry to this area and then with the aluminum company came dams on the Little Tennessee River then with TVA came dams on the Tennessee Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 River # and greater industry to the area Interviewer: but now that was about uh well when the when the aluminum company came is that that {X} around nineteen twenty was that they came to to Maryville and was that 027: #1 was that part of Maryville then who were either important in the mill # Interviewer: #2 they came # 027: no they came um to uh Old Field I believe it was called or Plain Field Interviewer: uh-huh it was somebody's farm actually several farms I imagine that 027: #1 they uh # Interviewer: #2 uh-huh # 027: bought to build the uh the first mill here because of the uh possibility of hydro electric Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 power and so they # started {X} and damming uh the river and Calderwood Street where you were Interviewer: uh-huh 027: parked today is named for Mr. Calderwood who uh designed the first dams Interviewer: #1 oh # 027: #2 And the # Calderwood's lived here for some time they were a very charming Interviewer: #1 couple # 027: #2 {D: was that so} # uh-huh That's interesting and uh all and all the streets in Alcoa are named for people who were either uh important in the mill industry or people who were important in the town of Alcoa Interviewer: oh 027: Hall Road for Charles M. Hall who uh invented the open furnace method I believe and so forth we have a Bessemer Street Interviewer: Yeah is that Gill or Gill 027: #1 Now Gill is a # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: local Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 family # that is where Maryville joins Alcoa and that was uh the Gill home place was where Middilon Sander is now Interviewer: I see well was that where I called out was I in Alcoa or Maryville when I called is that 027: uh you were probably in Alcoa the uh borderline runs Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 right # uh just below where you were Interviewer: it's it's deceptive on the map because on 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 the map it seems # that the two towns are really quite distinctly separated 027: #1 and actually the # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: city limits are on the same post Interviewer: #1 yeah uh-huh # 027: #2 {X} # Interviewer: that's uh uh now Maryville then what is has Maryville's growth say in the past forty years been related 027: industrial Interviewer: to and to the the development of Alcoa 027: #1 yes # Interviewer: #2 or the uh # 027: see this is the largest plant of the aluminium company's system Interviewer: uh-huh 027: #1 and uh the # Interviewer: #2 I didn't know that # 027: the uh president of the aluminium company um who retired this year was John Harper was a Blount County person Interviewer: huh 027: who started working while he was in college as a co-op student and during the time that he was president of course uh he was very the kind to back up works and building new plot lines and the old ones Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and so we really uh had a much more up to date plant then a plant this old Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 would be expected # to be and the north plant building out there by the airport uh was built just before World War Two and it was the largest factory built it deposed more floor space under one roof in acreage than any other building in the world and right afterwards he built the building in Louisville which is a little bit bigger Interviewer: oh 027: {NW} Interviewer: {X} uh {X} coming down from Knoxville uh I saw that enormous building it really surprised me it looked so big is that the you building you're talking about 027: #1 the north plant # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: #1 probably uh # Interviewer: #2 yeah # 027: it was on your left Interviewer: #1 on the left hand side # 027: #2 {X} # toward the airport Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 yes # Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 that's the north plant there three # three buldings Interviewer: oh 027: at the three main centers at Alcoa the north plant the west plant Interviewer: #1 that that kind # 027: #2 the south plant # Interviewer: that shocked me and I and it was then that I decided to fill the the Alcoa 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 {X} and so forth # 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 I really hadn't thought of them # in a {NS} {NS} uh {X} we could do some more things as we go along about uh Maryville you can just uh uh {X} {NS} I'll tell you {NS} 027: uh we uh Maryville the area is seven point oh square miles and Alcoa is eight point three four square miles and um Maryville was authorized to be laid out in seventeen and ninety-five the first settlement had begun in seventeen eighty-five now that was at the Houston's station and uh industrial activity began with lumber in seventeen eighty-eight and my father's business was lumber as I pointed out Interviewer: uh-huh 027: it came however from my cabinet making grandfather was a cabinet maker and uh he was also the undertaker because the cabinet Interviewer: #1 uh-huh yeah uh-huh # 027: #2 maker made caskets # that of his {X} weren't just being the undertaker our current undertaker is the outgrowth of grandfather's business Interviewer: is that right 027: our our one that we use here in town {X} but uh in World War One house were not necessary and so grandfather uh went uh no he had been building tables I beg your pardon they had done tables and Brumby Chair Company in Marietta had done the chairs these round mission type dining tables #1 which you # Interviewer: #2 Okay # 027: still see they're being collected now aren't many of them from the Cherokee which was grandfather's company then in World War One they started building houses because they were essential and dining tables weren't and then in World War Two houses weren't essential so they went into building materials Interviewer: Uh-huh 027: {NW} it is still a building material firm now Interviewer: I was wondering if all the {X} if so many of those furniture companies in North Carolina and Virginia I was wondering if those were German uh 027: some many of them are yes Says we're a world center for the production of aluminum paint {X} Interviewer: the combined population then of #1 Maryville and Alcoa is what about over twenty thousand? {NS} # 027: #2 what are you looking for any way? # Maryville is thirteen thousand five oh one, Alcoa is seven thousand nine hundred and fifty-four the metropolitan area is thirty nine thousand Interviewer: and that would just be in Blount County? 027: yes Maryville and Alcoa Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and the subdivisions surrounding Interviewer: that's a pretty good size 027: we're bigger than we seem to be Interviewer: Yeah 027: and we range uh in buildings from this Sam Houston School House which is where Sam actually taught school one year when he was needing to earn money to uh our new Interviewer: Was Sam Houston from Maryville? 027: his mother was born uh near here and he lived here as a boy he joined the army in Maryville down in front of the what is now the uh Bank of Maryville, it was the county court house at that time Interviewer: #1 uh Davy Crockett uh yeah Davy Crockett was born was born # 027: #2 Davy Crockett's from up um # yes my father took me to see his uh grave when I was a tiny little girl we had to go to the end of the road and walk but he was a great history buff Interviewer: #1 buried where he was born in # 027: #2 and he saw every # Crockett Station out of um oh is it near Jonesborough Interviewer: lime something 027: limestone #1 limestone mm-hmm # Interviewer: #2 Yeah # I saw that that's I'm gonna be up there 027: Well you can drive to his grave now Interviewer: #1 {X} yeah that's I think that's part # 027: #2 {D: you can} walk to it too {NS} # another interesting area here is of course our mountains Interviewer: I wanna talk to you about that and we'll get to that I have a question about mountains 027: good Interviewer: But I wanna just get the names for {D: some of those things}. Now Let's if we just just start out kind of counting slowly from one to fourteen 027: one two three four five six seven eight nine ten eleven twelve thirteen fourteen Interviewer: and the number after nineteen 027: is twenty Interviewer: twenty-six 027: is twenty-seven Interviewer: twenty-nine 027: is thirty Interviewer: thirty-nine 027: Is forty Interviewer: sixty-nine 027: is seventy Interviewer: ninety-nine 027: is one hundred Interviewer: nine hundred and ninety-nine 027: nine hundred and ninety-nine? one thousand Interviewer: and nine hundred ninety-nine thousand nine hundred and ninety-nine 027: {NW} That has to be a million I suppose Interviewer: Okay now if um uh speaking of the days of the talking about the days in the month we'll say uh what day of the month is the bill due usually 027: It depends on which bill where it comes from Interviewer: traditionally 027: are you tell oh the tenth Interviewer: okay alright what's the date before that called? 027: the ninth Interviewer: and then 027: eighth seventh six five four three two one Interviewer: now go back seventh now and the day before the seventh is 027: sixth Interviewer: and then 027: fifth fourth third second and the first Interviewer: Okay now if something happened you might say something happened suddenly what's another way you might say that it happened suddenly it happened 027: quickly abruptly Interviewer: um yeah I if you if you um you did something uh you've only done something one time is well I've only done that 027: once Interviewer: yeah now is there an expression that you might use suddenly that would include that word 027: I can't think of one Interviewer: Suddenly all- Would you would be more likely to say all of a sudden or all at once 027: oh all of a sudden yes Interviewer: Yeah 027: {NW} Interviewer: Okay and if something is two times as good as something else you say it's 027: twice as good Interviewer: alright and the months of the year 027: January February March April May June July August September October November December Interviewer: Okay one of the funniest things that ever {NS} {X} he got eleven of them but he just he just uh uh {D: scatter}. I- I've never heard anyone do that before uh the days of the week. 027: Sunday Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday Saturday Interviewer: and do you do you use the word Sabbath? 027: No Interviewer: how would you greet a person about oh ten a.m.? 027: Good morning. Interviewer: how late would you use that? 027: if I hadn't had lunch I might use it all afternoon {C: laughing} Interviewer: alright but usually until 027: until noon Interviewer: and after that what would you say? 027: good afternoon Interviewer: and how late would you use that? 027: 'til about six I suppose Interviewer: would you call now it's it's uh well it's uh five to six now let's say at at about five oh clock five p.m. what do you call that part of day? 027: I still call it afternoon evening to me is after supper Interviewer: Okay but uh a lot of people I think I think maybe mrs Hill I'll bet she would mind calling a lot of people they call evening any time afternoon 027: afternoon uh-huh Interviewer: but that's uh not {X}. Uh do you ever use the expression good day? 027: possibly talking with a very old friend who is very elderly and when you left you would say good day. I remember one or two of my mother's friends did this. but it isn't it wouldn't come naturally to me Interviewer: and it would be used in parting? 027: #1 yes # Interviewer: #2 rather than than greeting # 027: mm-hmm Interviewer: um they um and you say evening is the part of the day after supper how late would you use the word evening 027: {NW} 'til around ten or eleven I imagine Interviewer: #1 that way and then after that it would be # 027: #2 yes I would # night now it might uh I might be influenced right now by daylight savings time becasue you know- Interviewer: still {X} 027: It's light forever Interviewer: Yeah um now uh do you ever use uh in parting {D: after} uh say midnight or something uh what might you say? 027: probably good- good night Interviewer: do you ever use would you ever use good night in in meeting someone? 027: huh-uh Interviewer: so you'd use good night and good day the same way? 027: yes Interviewer: {X} the same and so we started work very early this morning we started work before 027: before breakfast Interviewer: now but this is really unpleasant we went out once we're going fishing and we got up and went out before 027: you're thinking of before daylight but I would never say it Interviewer: okay what would you use if you're talking no not daylight but now use something with the sun in it 027: #1 before sunup? now I have heard that. No. # Interviewer: #2 and say would you yeah you wouldn't use sunup though? would you use sunrise? # 027: no I would say uh I would give the hour before three or four or something like that Interviewer: um but you're talking about that part of day though you know you're talking about it in relation to the sun wouldn't you say either sunrise or sunup {X} 027: I might say I saw the sunrise Interviewer: Alright 027: I would be lying because I have seldom seen it #1 but I would # Interviewer: #2 alright but you uh # 027: not speak of the time of day as sunrise or sunset I would speak of seeing the sunrise or seeing the sunset #1 or moonrise # Interviewer: #2 okay # alright and uh in talking about the what time does the sunrise that at say the answer is six a.m. say the sun 027: rose Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: at six a.m. Interviewer: but uh but really by the time I got up the sun had already 027: risen Interviewer: alright and if um Tuesday is today Monday was 027: yesterday Interviewer: and Wednesday will be 027: tomorrow Interviewer: and if someone came to see you uh if someone's coming to see you not um this next Sunday but the following Sunday they might say he's coming 027: a week from Sunday Interviewer: thanks. Do you ever use Sunday week? 027: no Interviewer: is it common in the- 027: yes, I hear it but it isn't a term that comes readily to my Interviewer: right 027: lips Interviewer: How about a two week period of time? Do you have a term for that? 027: I would say two weeks out I think I have read fortnight more than I've heard it Interviewer: Okay. and if you wanted to know the time you might ask someone just casually 027: What time is it? Interviewer: and uh 027: or quelle heure {NW} Interviewer: What? 027: quelle heure (C: French) Interviewer: yeah and what and on um uh that was the one thing we learned in in in French I had to teach it to somebody everyday say quelle heure est-il and il est onze it was always eleven clock you know {NW} #1 uh that's the # 027: #2 no matter what time it was {NW} # Interviewer: uh and on my wrist I have a 027: watch Interviewer: and in about a half hour, what time will it be? 027: oh about six thirty Interviewer: and then about fifteen minutes after that 027: six forty-five Interviewer: now what's the another something another way of expressing that? 027: quarter to seven Interviewer: alright and if you hadn't seen someone for a long time. I haven't seen her for quite 027: I would say for a long time, I have heard many times uh when I was a child I guess in a coon's age Interviewer: mm-hmm how about um uh did you do that very often say oh I do that once in 027: oncei n a while Interviewer: um the term coon's age be more common than something spell 027: mm-hmm Interviewer: quite a spell it's quite a coon's age 027: coon's age I imagine though is going out with the black #1 emphasis # Interviewer: #2 right # 027: because I think uh I don't know whether it referred to a Negro or to an animal the coon #1 the raccoon # Interviewer: #2 yeah uh # 027: but I imagine it's uh become a no no Interviewer: right sure no doubt. Uh if nineteen seventy nineteen seventy was last year nineteen seventy-one is 027: this year Interviewer: and if a child tell me the age of the child say the child is 027: three Interviewer: the whole thing of three 027: three years old Interviewer: Yeah and if something happened that today is the thirteenth of July if something happened on July thirteenth nineteen seventy say that happened just 027: just a year ago Interviewer: talk about the weather today apart from the fact that it's hot, uh disregard that it's like it's what kind of day it's a 027: it's a beautiful day Interviewer: alright and if the sun weren't shining you might say it's uh 027: cloudy muggy messy Interviewer: Okay 027: dull Interviewer: yeah now what's a messy day is it 027: oh like this morning was when it's a little bit cloudy and raining a little bit now and then and just not pleasant to be out Interviewer: would a messy day necessarily involve some kind of 027: #1 precipitation yes # Interviewer: #2 some kind okay # uh and if the weather has been uh uh uh been nice but then it's uh a rain or snow is expected you might say that the weather is 027: it's lovely now but we're expecting it to be bad Interviewer: yeah but in uh 027: the prediction is for bad weather foul weather Interviewer: would you use something like changing breaking gathering turning or threatening 027: I wouldn't I hear it on the weather #1 report # Interviewer: #2 yeah # 027: but it doesn't come to me Interviewer: and those things up in the sky, you can't see them right here but the 027: stars clouds or #1 trees {C: laughing} # Interviewer: #2 Okay # when did you go to camp 027: from the time I was five until I started working after I had finished #1 college # Interviewer: #2 mm-hmm # 027: In fact I worked that summer at a camp uh out of Chicago that year with um children who had uh behavior problems Interviewer: where was the camp? 027: that last summer Lake Villa Illinois Interviewer: sure 027: mm-hmm I started out at uh Mintona which was just up here it's a little private camp up here here um at Chilhoweee and then I went to um Montreat in Montreat, North Carolina and I went to girl scout camp of course up here um camp Margaret Townsend which is no longer and um then I went eight or nine years to Camp Sequoia at Bristol which is affiliated with Sullins where I later went to college and I uh then as a counselor I went to various camps here there and beyond Interviewer: #1 Bristol Bristol # 027: #2 {D: upstate} # Interviewer: uh is that well Bristol Tennessee 027: #1 Virginia # Interviewer: #2 Is Bristol in Tennessee or Virginia? # 027: The state line goes down the middle of the main street which is called state street Interviewer: So it's in both 027: and there are two city governments there are two fire departments two police #1 departments # Interviewer: #2 really? # 027: etcetera mm-hmm Interviewer: really oh I've been beside myself trying to figure out so I look at a map at looking at motels you know they say Virginia. I thought maybe I shouldn't even bother with it {C: 027 laughing at the end} 027: when I was in school up there Virginia Bristol Virginia was wet and Brisol Tennessee was dry Interviewer: #1 oh that's convenient yeah # 027: #2 this created many interesting situations {C: laughing} # Interviewer: I thought of that the last weekend uh I was on the Tennessee Georgia border there at Copperhill and I thinks it's McCaysville I don't know or something like that maybe or {X} but they call it the twin cities Copperhill is on one side {X} 027: {D:ducktown} {NS} excuse me Interviewer: Sure {NS} {X} uh what would you call a a heavy rain of short duration? 027: a heavy rain of short duration a hard shower Interviewer: yeah uh did you ever use any any uh either humorous or colorful descriptive terms for that? 027: for the rain? Interviewer: Yeah. for a heavy rain of short #1 duration # 027: #2 cats and # dogs, downpour Interviewer: yeah 027: mm-hmm Interviewer: did they use things like uh uh trashmover or gully washer or {D: coat strangler} or any of those? 027: a gully washer and a cloudburst that may be a meteorolo- meteorological Interviewer: #1 yeah # 027: #2 term # I don't know Interviewer: now uh a storm with a lot of a thunder and lightening what would you call that 027: thunderstorm Interviewer: and talking about the wind the wind really 027: howled Interviewer: and hard it really 027: blew Interviewer: yeah and 027: uh blew a gale Interviewer: #1 yeah # 027: #2 possibly but that # comes more from our fishing then from our local Interviewer: yeah uh is now that's used more in in 027: #1 more down on the # Interviewer: #2 yeah # 027: gulf Interviewer: #1 yeah uh-huh # 027: #2 when you # Interviewer: now uh this is about the hardest the wind has 027: blown Interviewer: yeah and if the wind's coming from do you use uh descriptive terms for wind and its reference to direction 027: {D: no not not it blew north} Interviewer: #1 yeah # 027: #2 or anything like that # Interviewer: the word that we we're 027: in Texas Interviewer: okay now if a you talking about wind coming from the uh you're just saying that the wind's coming from the direction of Atlanta something you just say the winds from the 027: Bill will say it's from the north or the south I don't know my north from my Interviewer: #1 okay # 027: #2 south that well # Interviewer: um and if you're talking about just in terms of direction though if you're talking about the direction of um uh um oh say Johnson city from here 027: it was- that would be the east Interviewer: now now not just east though but it would also be 027: extreme east Interviewer: {D: I know} 027: eastern Tennessee now see that's as far as I would go I wouldn't get into north north east Interviewer: #1 okay I've got it # 027: #2 {X} # Interviewer: now if you're talking about rain then let's go back to {X} 027: #1 {NW} # Interviewer: #2 {X} # uh if it's just if if it's coming down very lightly lighter than a rain 027: #1 it's a shower # Interviewer: #2 what would you call it? # what about lighter than a shower? 027: sprinkling Interviewer: anything lighter than that? 027: I don't think so Interviewer: what if you looked out the window and couldn't see? 027: it'd be foggy Interviewer: alright and that's that stuff is 027: fog Interviewer: and if uh it doesn't rain for about twelve weeks you call that uh 027: a drought Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 or a long # dry spell Interviewer: okay now you now she didn't use that other term but 027: #1 drought but # Interviewer: #2 you no she used drought but she didn't use drought but you use # 027: we will- we will often speak of a long drought Interviewer: how would you distinguish a dry spell from a drought? 027: I guess a drought would go on for a long long time and a dry spell would be of shorter duration but as severe Interviewer: mm-hmm can you think about it and could you break it down into okay say we had a drought uh for the months of July and August 027: and uh October was also extremely #1 dry # Interviewer: #2 mm-hmm # but uh I see but so it would have to be almost a month or longer to be a drought 027: I think so Interviewer: and if the wind handn't been blowing then suddenly it begins you might say that the wind is 027: blowing {C: laughing} Interviewer: yeah uh but the wind if it's just starting to blow you know you might you might say the wind is starting to blow or you might say the wind is 027: I guess you're thinking of rising but that wouldn't Interviewer: yeah something like that yeah you don't 027: #1 I wou- wouldn't # Interviewer: #2 Okay # 027: think of Interviewer: #1 or picking up or um # 027: #2 it uh-uh # Interviewer: and if it's been uh you wouldn't use rising either 027: no Interviewer: and if and if uh if it's been blowing hard and then it uh it uh you might say now it's 027: stopped Interviewer: but it's in the process would you say yeah 027: stopping Interviewer: yeah. would you {D: use it} the specialized laying the wind is laying 027: never heard it Interviewer: she did you hear her say that now she said that the wind is the wind is laying uh or letting up something like that if uh uh yeah describing it's uh whether uh well it can be any time of the year {X} I think I'll put on a sweater today because it's a little 027: cool Interviewer: uh would you ever use anything like snappy sharp edgy keen or 027: chilly perhaps Interviewer: how about airish? 027: I have heard that I think it's #1 a delightful term # Interviewer: #2 isn't it {NW} uh # 027: and we used to have an old woman who worked for us who'd say oo it's airish Interviewer: #1 {NW} yeah um # 027: #2 today # Interviewer: yeah uh and if there's some white stuff on the grass that hasn't snowed you'd say it's 027: it's frost Interviewer: um and it did get pretty cold last night because the water in the pond 027: has a skim of ice on it or a skiff of ice Interviewer: #1 {X} # 027: #2 I don't know # which Interviewer: Would you use either one of those? 027: I would say it has ice on it Interviewer: Alright but skim and skiff do you 027: I heard Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 um # Interviewer: and you're talking when you say uh it has and if it gets much colder the the pond may 027: may freeze Interviewer: and it has 027: frozen Interviewer: yeah uh 027: even frozen solid Interviewer: okay yesterday it 027: mm-hmm was frozen solid Interviewer: alright. today it freezes yesterday it 027: was freezing Interviewer: or just yesterday it just a simple past it 027: froze Interviewer: yeah now um this house I want you to tell me about the rooms of the house 027: #1 {NW} it's hard to tell in this house # Interviewer: #2 but I think that while well # what do you call that by the way 027: the atrium Interviewer: okay now 027: we went back to the Roman house Interviewer: #1 uh-huh uh-huh # 027: #2 in the dictionary and found # the atrium as the cool unroofed paved or gravel area that had plants and tinkling fountain where the travelers rested Interviewer: uh-huh 027: and we wanted that sort of Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 atmosphere but we # couldn't have that and so we evolved this with our architect and so we call it an atrium and that is the pronunciation that our dictionary Interviewer: uh-huh 027: gave we have many Interviewer: #1 yeah # 027: #2 questions about our # pronunciation Interviewer: how long how long ago did you have the house built? 027: we moved in on July the third seven years ago Interviewer: #1 uh-huh. is that right? # 027: #2 last week. mm-hmm. # Interviewer: now uh you called let's take the house you you lived in 027: #1 yes # Interviewer: #2 most of your you lived in one did you live in one house uh # 027: mother's home, my parents' home Interviewer: okay. now how uh just describe tell me the kind of give me a a description of the rooms in the house and what they were called 027: the uh you entered the front door you came into the living room and between the living room and the dining room there was um um there were book cases with an open space above with columns so that we had we called it the living room and the dining room but it was there were no doors between them it was one area and we had club meetings and so forth we could have a large circle of chairs and behind the living room was the den which was a very small room and the telephone was there and a comfortable couch there was a comfortable sofa in the living room but the one in the den was a couch and behind the dining room was the breakfast room and behind that the kitchen there was a central hall and there was a beadroom and a sleeping porch and a bathroom downstairs then upstairs uh when I was growing up there were two bedrooms and my playroom later there were three bedrooms and still later after my mother was widowed there was an apartment and then she uh enclosed the end of the hall and had a guest room and a bath up there and an apartment which had an outside entrence that came off the front porch the porches were screened and there was a full basement underneath Interviewer: you call the now the now now tell me the rooms in this house 027: the one by the front door is a parlor that is my grandmother {X} parlor furniture out of her parlor and it is I loved grandmother very much and I enjoyed her parlor and I loved her furniture and I have recreated her parlor although hers was large and had red {X} wallpaper and lace Interviewer: #1 mm, uh-huh # 027: #2 curtains and a white fur rug and the tall # tall Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 ceilings and the # chandelier it's the same Interviewer: #1 how do you- what's the difference between a living room then a parlor? # 027: #2 furniture # we're living in the living room it's it's more informal Interviewer: mm-hmm and I I do sit in the parlor and lots of time when someone comes we'll have a cup of tea #1 mm-hmm # 027: #2 in there # the um I first suggested that you do your interviewing in there because it was more private and then I decided that uh you wouldn't find the chairs too comfortable for a long time they're Victorian Interviewer: That would have been okay but the thing that interested me that you said about that that I thought was very uh I thought was very significant {X} 027: #1 yes I felt that # Interviewer: #2 might might be less comfortable # 027: she would be more comfortable in the informal Interviewer: #1 mm-hmm # 027: #2 atmosphere # of the living room rather than in the formal atmosphere of the Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 parlor # Interviewer: that's good that well that's so so you're thinking. #1 now uh did your grandmother have a living room as well as a parlor? and the parlor was more formal? # 027: #2 yes mm-hmm # the the parlor was closed and we went into the parlor on special occasions and on Christmas the Christmas tree was in the parlor and Interviewer: Oh I see uh-huh 027: this sort of this Interviewer: {NW} did uh in any of the houses you've lived in or your parents or granparents lived in have any of these houses have a separate um a separate kitchen as a separate building 027: #1 uh I think # Interviewer: #2 separate from the house # 027: grandmother McReynolds' house probably had had it was connected to the house from the time I can remember it but that was a very old house and it had still had slave quarters which were used for a a wash house and a storage and this that and the other and I imagine that the kitchen had been separate because it was a separate {D: aisle} and could easily have been connected to the house and there had been changes in the house from time to time Interviewer: now I just wondered if it had a special name um 027: I don't know if it did if it did it would of I know what you're thinking about is a summer kitchen uh there was a house here in Maryville that had one Interviewer: they did use the term summer kitchen though in this 027: #1 and they cooked out there uh # Interviewer: #2 part of the- # 027: in the summer because it was too hot Interviewer: right that's exactly what I was looking for but I- They're- they're very interesting 027: {X} Interviewer: yeah well I haven't I haven't heard that I haven't uh uh that in a single instance of that now now the rooms in this house what 027: uh well starting down the hall there uh there's a guest bathroom and a guest room and uh this little room we call the atrium bedroom it's the room where I work got my type writer in there put up the sewing machine the knitting machine when I want Interviewer: #1 mm-hmm # 027: #2 to # but it does have uh a trundle bed under a sofa and it has curtains and so forth and so when the children are here I can make it into a bedroom that's very comfortable and acceptable uh so it's sort of dual purpose and then going on back there is the master bathroom and dressing room and the master bedroom Interviewer: mm-hmm and this of course is the living room dining room and then there's the kitchen and the laundry and the cats' room and then outside Bill has a workshop what's the cats' room? 027: #1 it's # Interviewer: #2 is that uh-huh # 027: the room where the cats Interviewer: #1 uh-huh # 027: #2 live # Our cats have cages in their room and it also has a sink Interviewer: #1 {NW} # 027: #2 uh for water supply {X} # Interviewer: that's great 027: they're- they have their draperies with the cat uh design on them so forth Interviewer: well that my my it isn't so strange my sister has uh my sister and brother in law both work and they have uh uh a cat and a dog and they put the cat and dog get along and they keep they have uh they have them in a room and they have the room papered you know {NW} it's really it's just uh it's can we talk about how high the ceiling is can you tell me {X} this room ceiling {X} oh the ceiling is 027: I don't really know it's probably a little over eight feet Interviewer: okay and the smoke goes up the 027: chimney Interviewer: and the part that extends out of the floor 027: the hearth Interviewer: and the part the two things that hold the logs in place 027: andirons {X} Interviewer: and uh you don't have one of these either the thing that goes across the top of the fireplace 027: oh the mantels no we don't have mantels Interviewer: uh-huh 027: we deliberately did not build them Interviewer: now did did you ever call that you remember your parents or grandparents calling it any thing other than the mantel 027: no uh I know it was called at times a chimney shelf but I haven't heard it used you could turn your old mantel pieces Interviewer: uh and you've never heard uh fireboard 027: no I thought the fireboard was the back of the fireplace that reflected the heat Interviewer: alright. they call the fireplace a fireboard too 027: #1 oh the mantel I didn't know that # Interviewer: #2 and the and the the mantel the mantel that that's a a midland expression, it's fairly common {X} # 027: didn't know that at all Interviewer: now a large log that you burn in the fireplace 027: the back log Interviewer: and the uh smaller pieces of wood that you use to start a fire 027: kindling Interviewer: now would you have a a name for the even smaller pieces that you use to get the kindling started, or do think of the kindling as the first? 027: I think of the kindling as the first because we use newspaper and kindling, of course here we have a gas starter but I imagine you're thinking of chips Interviewer: yeah chips or pine or {X} or any of those or fat pine 027: #1 chips # Interviewer: #2 fat {X} # 027: is all I'm familiar with Interviewer: and talking about using it uh saying in the past they use to burn coal 027: #1 mm-hmm in a grate # Interviewer: #2 so yeah # but you're gonna use the word stove and say they burned coal 027: you're thinking of coal stove Interviewer: mm-hmm alright so you'd say they burned coal 027: in a stove Interviewer: yeah this is in reaches into the stove 027: #1 oh oh you put into {NW} burn it in # Interviewer: #2 {X} you don't burn it into right and the black stuff you clean out of a stove pipe # 027: is soot Interviewer: and out of a fireplace 027: oh now you have white ashes Interviewer: yeah that's uh and I'm sitting in a 027: chair Interviewer: #1 and you mentioned before the distinction between the couch and a and a sofa I wish you'd elaborate on that # 027: #2 mm-hmm oh # well it was just to me uh that the sofa in the living room was the new piece Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: uh that was very nice and the couch in the den was uh what one of our friends called an old flopper Interviewer: mm-hmm {NW} but yet you'd do you uh do you think uh uh do you make any distinction between the terms couch and sofa now in terms if you're going to buy furniture 027: um no I would say I was buying a couch and the salesman would say that's a sofa Interviewer: mm-hmm okay so you wouldn't use that was if you used the word 027: I do use the word sofa they have taught me to Interviewer: #1 uh-huh but it's not- # 027: #2 it's not # indigenous Interviewer: alright good now in the bedroom there the uh piece of furniture that has drawers 027: chest of drawers Interviewer: and there's another one that now does a chest of drawers have a mirror 027: not attached to it it may have one hanging over it Interviewer: what about one that has a mirror attached to it 027: would be a bureau or a dresser Interviewer: what's the difference between a bureau and a dresser? 027: I think the bureau was the bigger taller old piece and the dresser um the bureau would be taller like a chest of drawers actually but had a mirror attached and the dresser would uh be lower and you could stand or sit at it Interviewer: #1 do you # 027: #2 and apply make up and so forth # Interviewer: do you think uh between men's and women's uh one for men and one for women's clothes? 027: uh no could be becuase we don't have any we have ours built in Interviewer: uh-huh well I mean when how about when uh 027: Uh well now my mother had a dressing table and a chest of drawers and my father had a chest of drawers and then we had grandmother's bureau {C: laughing} Interviewer: #1 but now # 027: #2 which was just an inherited big piece # Interviewer: but- but a dresser could belong to a man or a woman then 027: I would assume that dresser would belong to a woman actually and a chest of drawers to a man Interviewer: okay and taken together all of these things we've been talking about are all different pieces of 027: would be bedroom furniture Interviewer: alright and they uh in any house that you've lived in or see have you ever seen a bedroom that has a little alcove containing a bed 027: {X}