027: Not disturb us. Interviewer: {D: I've been} {X} Just far too many cokes a lot more than I should. {X} working alright. {D: I forgot} {X} {D: do you have any sort of a} {X} 027: #1 {NW} # Interviewer: #2 {X} # Round the first of June I spent six weeks uh driving {D: the states}. {X} And I had no one around {D: using a car}. And I had to drink uh just coke cola {D: mixed} {X} So I picked up a bad habit I {D: guess}. 027: It's not a bad habit let me show ya. And do you have a Playmate? Um a cooler Interviewer: uh-huh 027: This is the most fantastic thing to carry in your car {NS} Interviewer: I was stopping certainly at every service station I came to that is nice. 027: I-it comes in a larger size #1 a smaller size would be a # Interviewer: #2 {X} # {X} 027: You get about eight cups in there. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: Cold ones. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: Out of a machine. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: Sprinkle a little ice on it {NS} #1 And it goes for hours # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: I used to take down to the pool when I had {X} in there Interviewer: Yes ma'am 027: And I oh- it's a J-C Penny product. They were on sale for fourth of July. Seven dollars and eleven cents. Interviewer: Oh {D: I} just stopped at every service station I came to. 027: {C: laughs} You probably don't like ice {X}. #1 {D: on the way getting it to you} # Interviewer: #2 {X} # Uh I'll go through the rest of the list of groups and you can tell me {D: if you know any one} uh. Germans any terms you ever heard for {X}? 027: No and I wouldn't have cuz I'm German. Interviewer: That's alright.D My mother's people are German too the [D: Teils}. 027: mm-hmm Interviewer: and two {D: Teil} brothers who settled in Lowndes county Alabama. I wanna say in the early part of the nineteenth century and so on. Uh {D: I didn't uh} we all that's where the dark hair and dark eyes come from believe it or not {X} believe it or not all dark and {X} dark hair and eyes. 027: There's my grandfather whom I'm supposed to resemble exactly. {NW} I never saw him. He was uh educated to be a teacher. Interviewer: mm 027: But came here to escape military service and when he was twenty-one. {NS} And um. Interviewer: So your grandfather was from Europe? 027: So was my grandmother. Interviewer: Oh. 027: {NW} Uh-huh and I don't know people say why don't you have those {X}. {NW} But I don't know what color they were. Interviewer: mm 027: {C: laughs} Because I never saw grandfather and grandmother was an old lady when I knew her and her hair was white and her eyes were blue. An- but my father had a picture of her with very dark hair and so I don't know. Interviewer: The uh my- I- I resemble my grandfather very much too in fact I had a great aunt that I never met lived in Tuscaloosa And I was walking one day down the street. She was out raking and she must have been in her eighties. 027: yeah Interviewer: {X} picked it up and handed it to her. Didn't know at the time this was my great aunt. So I just started talking to her she said you look very familiar to me I said finally I told her {X} She said that she had people down there too well I did too and we got to talking. Pretty soon though she said well you know you look just like my {X} grandson. 027: #1 {C: laughs} # Interviewer: #2 {X} # So it was the resemblance was was that much and 027: #1 uh-huh # Interviewer: #2 my # sister and I {D: look}. And the longer I look we j- just almost exactly alike. {X} Uh it's just amazing the the resemblance {X} #1 {X} # 027: #2 uh-huh # Interviewer: #1 What about # 027: #2 {D: that's real interest-} # Interviewer: ever heard any name for the Dutch? 027: {X} {NW} But uh we had two German families here and um. {NW} The uh the Reeders now I did hear them call Dutch Reeder. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: A woman and a man was always called Dutch Reeder. And I have no idea why. Interviewer: mm-hmm mm That was kind of {D: a good name}. 027: Uh-huh yeah his name was Herman. {NS} He was a baker. I have no idea Grandfather was educated for a teacher and so he was the cabinet maker. Interviewer: mm 027: And so he was By virtue of being the cabinet maker he was the uh undertaker. Because cabinet maker made the uh caskets. So my father's spent his uh rainy Saturdays laying caskets. Interviewer: Oh. 027: And uh none of the boys was interested in the undertaking business. And so they uh sold it when grandfather could no longer carry on and that is {X} that you see down on Broadway today. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: {C: laughs} {X} That's our undertaker. But that's just real funny yes. Interviewer: My my grand- I- I guess {D: they were all} my grandfather's people were farmers until until my grand- grandfather moved to Montgomery a little outside Montgomery in the late twenties. He was th- the only policeman for the {D: big ol''} town called {C: name of a town}. {D: the} police force for I guess thirty years. Uh the only law enforcement in. 027: mm-hmm Things in two. Interviewer: {D: He} should have. 027: I think Montgomery is a beautiful town though. Interviewer: Oh I {D: think it} it was a nice place to grow up in of course. There's just not very many of us is changing too and. 027: There used to be a white house on a corner right on the main street that had a lot of vine lace too much really. And they had glassed in a whole lot it had been porches. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: They had gla- it was a three story house I used to always look for that when we went through because I loved that house. Interviewer: They started restoring a number of the old homes both the Victorian and the antebellum. 027: mm-hmm Interviewer: Cuz they're and uh there's a lot a lot to do I guess they. The only bad thing about it now is the crime rate. It's gotten so bad but but I guess that mostly {X} so. 027: {X} I got scared to death {X} with Bill the other day I went in the dressing room and I turned around and our yardman was right behind me and. If I hadn't recognized Thomas who's been with us for twenty years it would've scared the wits out of me. But he just wanted to ask how Bill was. Bill was in the hospital. And he didn't realize he was doing anything wrong so I couldn't say anything to him about it but I just don't go swimming with Thomas {X}. Interviewer: {NS} Uh any slang name terms you ever heard for say Italians? 027: {C: pronounced like aitai} but I probably heard that over the T-V. Interviewer: What about you ever heard dago or anything like that? 027: Yeah mm-hmm when I was growing up. But then again um I probably heard that from one of my sister's boyfriends when she was in college. Because we just never had any. Interviewer: uh-huh 027: Uh this was a Scotch-Irish Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: settlement. Pardon me with the exception of the two German families. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: {C: laughs} what they said about us I don't know. #1 {C: laughs} # Interviewer: #2 {X} # What about uh for for Poles? Any names for the poles o- or Russians? 027: Yes Ruskies. that- but that was during World War Two. Interviewer: Uh Czechs? Lithuanians? {X} 027: No I have something from Lithuanian but I was trying to think what it was. Interviewer: Uh any slang terms you ever heard for Englishmen? 027: Oh yes my husband lived in England for two years. They are Limeys. Interviewer: mm-hmm What about Irishmen any slang terms you might've heard for them? 027: I'm sure my mother had some but I did not know what they were. Interviewer: What about Scotsmen? 027: No. Interviewer: Uh French? 027: Yeah. That again comes from Bill. Frogs. Interviewer: mm What about uh the uh Cajuns? Got any kinda any names for them? 027: No just Cajuns I found out about the Cajuns by fishing down there for about five summers down off the {X}. Interviewer: mm-hmm There are some in south Alabama I think. 027: Oh really? Interviewer: uh in fact around {C: name of a county} and Mobile counties. There at the gulf Bayou La Batre places like that. 027: mm-hmm Interviewer: uh 027: Well the first time I ever heard of a Cajun he came up to the door and started talking to me. Interviewer: {NS} 027: {C: laughs} I was totally lost. Interviewer: We have a number of tapes from that area {D: very difficult to} transcribe and. 027: You can understand them after you know them and have been around them for a while. Interviewer: {NS} 027: But it really takes some hard work. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: But they're fascinating people. Interviewer: Yeah. 027: They really are. Interviewer: Any names for Greek? 027: Gods {NW} Interviewer: Cubans? 027: Strangely enough no. Interviewer: Uh Puerto Ricans? Uh Mexicans or? 027: Mexicans are wetbacks. Interviewer: Those are the ones that come across? What about those who grew up were born in Me- Mexico? Parents who say {D: who} moved to the United States {D: particularly the United States}. 027: That I have no- no terminology. Interviewer: Scandinavians? 027: No. Interviewer: Uh Canadians? 027: No when I think of a Scandinavian person I usually think of a person who's blond and beautiful but other than that um. Interviewer: I- I'm sure that there are some people {X}. 027: {C: laughs} Well deli meat fits right in. Interviewer: What about Democrats or Republicans ever heard any slang terms for them? 027: Oh good heavens. My father was a Democrat and my mother was a Republican. {C: laughs} Interviewer: #1 I guess they got in a squabble or two. # 027: #2 {C: laughs} # {C: laughs} Oh that's why I'm an independent. {NS} Interviewer: Ever know any slang terms that {X} {D: far end}? 027: Oh yes Bill is a has been until he's been ill a very active Republican. So I can just anything you say I can say yes I've heard that one. {NS} Interviewer: I don't think I've ever heard any {X} as far as I know. 027: Oh yes um. With every campaign they come up. The special slang terms. I was trying to think and you were talking about Roman Catholicism probably the most I ever heard of that Catholicism when I was growing up was when Al Smith Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: was running for president and I was in the second or third grade. Interviewer: mm 027: And uh the term then for Democrats was Catholic lovers. Interviewer: Uh-huh mm-hmm 027: And um And then {C: name of a politician} um {X} the Republicans were all {X}. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: And uh in between campaigns they're just Democrats and #1 Republicans. # Interviewer: #2 mm-hmm # uh Now if someone who maybe especially a few years ago would have a man may have real long hair beard wear beads and that kinda thing? 027: Hippie. Interviewer: mm-hmm And {X} do you know about the style of dress or was it {X} or? 027: #1 Style {D: white}. # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: A total style of life. Interviewer: Tell me what {X} kind of lifestyle social? 027: No it was uh lifestyle and incidentally I was in the park in San Francisco the day they had their rally. Interviewer: Oh really? 027: mm-hmm And one of them took a picture of me {D: look at} the square. {C: laughs} Interviewer: I was only in San Francisco in the airport for a couple hours one day um. 027: Just give me a day in San Francisco anytime. Interviewer: Uh now say someone who uh they were in the same section {D: that you very early} grew up with very close to did everything around out together {X}. 027: Best friend. Interviewer: mm And uh say you're someone who's kind of a surrogate parent any name for somebody who becomes surrogate parent? 027: Yeah aunt so and so. Interviewer: Okay. And uh {X} same thing. uh When you were coming up as a girl did you have a group of kids that you hung around with or played with {X}? 027: Um not really because I was um {NS} usually sick. I was run over by a car when I was very small and I was um quite often in the hospital having surgery and this that and the other and I had my group. But I wasn't with them as much. But they were they were a very loyal group and we are still the group Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: that those of us who are left in town. Interviewer: And di- did y'all have a name for yourselves what kind of would you call yourselves anything? 027: #1 uh # Interviewer: #2 {X} # or a gang? 027: The rest of 'em did but I wasn't with them enough. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: They called themselves six links because there were six of 'em I think. #1 And I would make seven yes. # Interviewer: #2 {X} # 027: But we all ran around with the same boys and um. I think the best summer I ever ha- I went to camp then every summer. So when they were doing the summer things I wasn't here because heat affects me and we didn't have air conditioning in those days. And I went to camp in June and came back at the end of August and um if I wasn't having surgery. And my patient number at Warm Springs is two forty-eight. I was a patient of doctor {X} who was the first uh Interviewer: {X} 027: key surgeon and so he took me on. He took his patients and completed them. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: But I was not allowed to go in the water because they didn't know what caused polio. Interviewer: mm-hmm uh-huh 027: It made me something mad they let my sister go in. {NW} And uh so I didn't have the closeness with the group that someone would who woul- I went to school maybe two or three months out of the year and was tutored the rest of the time. And then I went away to boarding school and I was the only one in the group who did. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: See I came out right out of high school right at the heart of the Depression. {NW} the heart of the Depression that was my sister. {NW} Yeah we had a strike {X} it's the same thing here {C: laughs} precisely. We had a stri- a real strike with uh one or two men killed and it lasted for several months and it threw the economy off for three or four years and then came World War Two. Interviewer: Uh what kinds of games and all did you play when you were little? 027: Uh I was one of the bookworms. {NS} And anybody I could force to play parcheesi with me or uh oh I still have it somewhere. It's a real antique. The board with the X with one marble missing out of the middle. You play it solitary and then you end up with one marble in the middle and all the rest of them out. Interviewer: Some chinese checkers? 027: No it's a variation thereof and once you learn it you can do all these little things and uh. Old maids {NW} hearts rook and then when I was active I liked to skate and I had an what we called an {X} then in the backyard that my dad had built for me. I think now it would be called monkey bars. Interviewer: Uh-huh 027: Mine wasn't as elaborate as they are now. And um {NW} I liked to shoot. Interviewer: mm 027: I was a riflery instructor when I got older. And I loved to ride but I kept falling off the horse because my leg wouldn't my muscles wouldn't hold and they didn't know enough then about physical therapy or realize that that would be the best thing for me and so instead they stopped me. Interviewer: mm 027: And uh just the usual things. Interviewer: Ever pla- did y'all ever play any hiding games or anything like that? 027: Oh yes and red light i- in the evening until it got #1 dark. # Interviewer: #2 {X} # red light. 027: I don't even remember. Interviewer: {C: laughs} 027: Was something about running and you freeze when somebody yells red light. And then there were giant steps and. Interviewer: {X} 027: Oh yes {X} and um I think that was giant steps. Um hide and seek of course. Interviewer: mm-hmm Did you ever play any kind of kind of running game where you had had two lines over here and one side would call {X} {D: over and} over and you have to break through the arms of? 027: Now I didn't because I wasn't strong enough. The others did yeah Interviewer: What did they call that do you remember? Ever hear it called like red rover or anything like? 027: Yeah red rover red rover come over mm-hmm. Right Interviewer: Anything ring games or anything that {D: may have played}? 027: Any what? Interviewer: Kind of ring games uh played you know where you use the circle? 027: Oh yes and they were um well we actually did square dancing only we didn't call it that. Interviewer: uh-huh 027: Uh to music Interviewer: {NW} 027: and um I realized later when I did square dancing that that's what we had been doing. Interviewer: What about the boys did they ever play any kind of ball games or games with {D: ten pins} anything? 027: Oh no it was uh baseball and basketball and tennis. We were great on tennis around here and um {NW} I don't know of the time I paid much attention the boys it was more girl games. Interviewer: {X} Uh what about any any games that they ever played with knives or anything where they toss it down like that. 027: They did I never paid any attention to those. Interviewer: What about 027: And marbles yeah it was bring always the marbles. Interviewer: Ever played with jacks or anything? 027: Yeah mm-hmm I don't know how I've got to learn haven't I? I've got a whole crew of grand nieces and nephews that are going to be expecting me to know how to play jacks. Interviewer: What about rope games have you ever played any kinds of rope games? {X} 027: Oh sure oh yes that was recess I always jumping the rope. Interviewer: Did they have a column or anything they usually built or {X}? 027: No. I really don't because I didn't jump I just watched. Interviewer: What about any kind of rough games that kids {X} played or? {NS} 027: I was shielded from the rough games and I don't know. Interviewer: Now 027: And there was so much at the time that I wasn't there that I don't know really what they were doing. Interviewer: And what about any kind of {D: word} games {X} about {D: word} games people would play anything like that? 027: I don't know. Interviewer: What about new kids {X} pretty much accepted immediately or was any kind of is- initiation wise you're gonna get to go through a? 027: {C: laughs} We had very few new kids moving in but they definitely go through a miserable period. Um which just lasted a day or two really and then they were usually I can't remember but two who were not accepted in school. And one stole things and the other one I don't know what she did but something equally Interviewer: What kinds of things would they would be miserable for? 027: Well they were different and they felt different. And we all sort of stared at them and they stared at us and then finally somebody would break the ice and Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: talk and we had one very delightful boy who had lived several places who came here his father was with the Aluminum company and um. {NW} He came here from Canada and he had the most fascinating blend of an English accent and a southern drawl that you have ever heard. And he was just {NS} he was just a nice kid and that was during one of the periods when I wasn't walking. {NW} And the first day that he was here he volunteered to carry my lunch tray over to me. And so he didn't go through any initiation period. Bob was accepted immediately. And it was that one little thing that he did and the fact that he rocked back and forth when he talked he rocked from one foot to the other. And {C: laughs} he had that funny slow way of talking that was so utterly foreign to us. And um incidentally he turned out very very well and he did I couldn't tell you how a chief engineer of something or other for some company to the Navy Interviewer: mm 027: He died last year {NW} of a malignancy but He was really a great guy he had no breaking in period but he's the only one that I can think of and I think it was really that um Interviewer: His own initiative. 027: of carrying my tray that first day because somebody always volunteered to carry my tray over to me from the cafeteria. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: And then they would try to pick up food I didn't like {X} {C: laughs} {X} {C: laughs} Interviewer: {X} When you were a little older seventeen eighteen what kinds of parties and so forth would you have? 027: Uh we never danced {NS} we didn't dance until just about the time I went to college. Interviewer: mm 027: Dancing was taboo in Maryville. Interviewer: mm 027: But we had snap socials. Interviewer: {X}? 027: Uh the girls sat over here the boys sat over there and then one of the boys would come over and snap his finger in front of you and then y'all would go out and outside. unchaperoned and take a walk. {X} Interviewer: {C: laughs} 027: You know dancing is simple but this is {X}. {C: laughs} So that's um and then we would uh when we had parties in our homes Interviewer: mm 027: our parents would prep- try to organize a few games and then get it going and leave it alone and. Interviewer: Did did girls ever spend the night with each other {X}? 027: Oh sure but we did not have slumber parties. They came later. When we spent the night with somebody we went to bed went to bed went to sleep eventually Interviewer: Now we like to stay up all night. 027: {C: laughs} Interviewer: I'm in bed by ten O clock {X}. 027: {NW} {X} off the telephone at two this morning. Interviewer: Oh I- I guess I guess when I got married my wife goes to bed so early I started doing it too. {X} 027: That's good. Interviewer: Uh Can't do it any other way. 027: {C: laughs} leaves you fresh for the day's occupations. Interviewer: When you uh as a girl coming up what kind of music and so forth did you listen to? 027: Whatever was popular at the time just. Interviewer: What what styles what {X} Lot of people talk about rock music {D: did anybody remember any}? 027: Uh rag was the thing. Interviewer: {X} 027: And uh See I came up in the thirties and the forties. Interviewer: Oh. 027: And the big band era came just about the time I got to college and so all our dances were Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: fantastic as far as I'm concerned formals with the the really big bands and I heard them all. Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: And we spent as much time gathered around the bandstand watching 'em particularly the drummers. Interviewer: uh-huh 027: And we knew that the drummers were on something but we didn't know what. Interviewer: uh-huh 027: But we knew they had to be on something to drum like that. But as far as trying to get some or that never crossed any of our minds that I know of. But um now I- it was a wonderful era to grow up in it really was as far as I'm concerned in particular with music. Interviewer: mm-hmm What about now any particular style of music you listen to now? 027: Yeah I've got two {X} Miller albums that I've worn Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: completely out. I still go back to the old ones there are some of the new ones that I like. And uh course some classical music but I have never been trained in classical music which is a shame. I have been trained in {NW} art and literature but not in music. And so what I know about classical music I had picked up. But there's some of it that I enjoy very much and there is some country and western that we like. Interviewer: mm 027: But not {X} not too much um {NW} well not the Nashville style. That's not Tennessee and that's not hillbilly and that's not um. Bluegrass is more what we grew up with if we grew up with it and we really didn't. Interviewer: {X} That's uh really all the questions I had anything about the local culture so forth that I didn't ask that that I might've asked but {X}? 027: Now or then? Interviewer: {X}? 027: We're getting {NS} some very good cultural a- well now then back in the olden days we had the uh Lyceum program which came to the college like once a month #1 and # Interviewer: #2 Did you go # to Maryville College or? 027: No I'm the first one in five generations of my family that didn't. I went to a girl's school which no longer exists {NW} but which is coming back. {X}. Interviewer: mm-hmm now I 027: And uh then I went to U-T. And uh my parents were forty mile far and so I after I had been {X} for two years they said we would appreciate it if you would go to U-T and live at home. Because we so like to have you around and so that's what I did. I didn't particularly want to but I enjoyed it thoroughly. And uh but we're get- we're having um. Then we had really excellent programs like uh the Trapp Family was here Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: when they first came to the states. And uh {NW} I heard um {NW} Pablo what was his #1 name great cello yeah. # Interviewer: #2 {X} # mm {X} 027: mm-hmm And we really had some great ones and then they cut all that out. Interviewer: mm 027: And we had nothing. Interviewer: uh-huh 027: And um now of course Clarence Brown is giving U-T this magnificent theater. Interviewer: {X} that really is. 027: And we uh Bill and I belong to the first night club and. We didn't get to go last year at all but um in the other two years that it's been We feel that it really is an {X} gallery. {NS} It's doing I think a terrific thing for Knoxville. And uh right next to it of course is the town's collection of silver at the uh Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: {X} a great deal of which has been stolen. Interviewer: {NW} Oh really. 027: Yes irreplaceable things. And the Blount Mansion is one thing that you may not have seen that uh I dragged all the children to when they were little. I've been through it since I was little many times and seen it grow. And it really was a mansion when it was built but it was the first frame house. Interviewer: {D: frame} 027: And uh we have of course the summer dramas. Interviewer: uh-huh 027: And under these hills is well worth seeing. And um I can't I can't say much for the passion plays. I know that they're a lot of tourist traps of course but I think and then the uh The {X} theater is coming back beautifully restored. And my mother remembers seeing people like Jenny Lind there {X}. Interviewer: Ah 027: And um so Knoxville has had and Maryville has had a fine cultural past and I think it's going to return. Interviewer: mm 027: {NW} And Maryville has a very nice art collection at uh the college. And we have all we always have an adult education uh program going both at Maryville and at U-T and uh. I've taken advantage of several of those Interviewer: mm-hmm 027: courses I took one last winter over my husband's dead body. {X} he doesn't like for me to go out and uh. But I thought it was time that I left him a little bit and so I took one. And uh I think we're coming. Interviewer: Is Maryville {X} growing pretty rapidly too isn't it? 027: Too rapidly I liked it the way it was. {C: laughs} {NW} I liked it the way it was I really di-. Interviewer: {X} From the his- growth rate. 027: uh Interviewer: {D: Do you go through} Morristown and all that all that valley area? 027: Well of course uh {X} {NS} coming to Morristown is what started it going as it has done and then when {X} came down to Charleston. Interviewer: mm 027: And that really gave it a boost but um {NW} well first federal has already done a hundred and ninety-two loans this month Interviewer: And they just? 027: to give you an idea and that is running that's what they've been running for about two or three years. Interviewer: That's tremendous you know for a {X} so {C: end of reel}.