Interviewer:  Did you ever hear that uh {D: clock towers} used X?
556:  Oh yeah.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Oh yeah, black-eyed peas.
Interviewer:  New Years.
556:  Yeah, you'd take a last New Years away down at Whiteman's Cafe in Richmond they brought us a side bowl of {X} black-eyed peas. Without ordering it. They serve it every New Years.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  And many of the cafes do that. Without ordering. Supposed to be good luck.
Interviewer:  I see. We talked about uh about the uh use of of uh of pictures that either away a professor when you went to college. Still uh walked past a graveyard uh were the we used the word candid, right? Haints.
556:  Haints.
Interviewer:  Haints and uh haunts.
556:  Haints and never say haunted. It hainted.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. And uh this and haints used agents agents of the devil.
556:  No, no. That's no. A haint is merely the de- the spirit of the departed person. Say you're hainted. That don't mean no. #1 It just means #
Interviewer:  #2 I don't think it # {NW} necessarily evil.
556:  No, no. Haint's good folks. Depending how good the man was before he died.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  I've heard it many one say if you don't do so-and-so, I'm gonna haint you.
Interviewer:  I see. {X}
556:  Gonna haint you if you don't behave. {NS}
Interviewer:  Did the uh {NW} a person refer to uh what they would use for devil?
556:  Hoo doo. You know, the voodoo.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  I never heard it called hoo doo. They called it hoo doo. {NS} Oh yeah. They
Interviewer:  What would uh you say to a child? You better be good, or
556:  Better be good. Uh. Well, they generally had somebody that was that passed away that was rather evil. I know this nigger boy I tell you my grandfather the man that formerly owned his house was a man named Smith. Old man Smith. {NS} And he was always telling him you don't look out, old man Smith's gonna get you.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  See him upstairs. {D: I tell you by the second third it was handy.} Old man Smith's up there. If you don't watch out, old man Smith's gonna get you. {D: Either of us could've put a rough tack.}
Interviewer:  The uh ever seen the {D: boogey man} or?
556:  Mm-hmm. Boogey bear. That was a favorite term to the kids. Boogey bear. Boogey bear'll get you.
Interviewer:  They talked about a force of evil in the church. What was how did they refer to in church. It'd be God versus
556:  Well, they used to refer to him as Satan, the Devil, and the lower regions, and so on. {NS}
Interviewer:  A trip to uh town was see might go to uh they call places for books uh. Names or that special word?
556:  For what?
Interviewer:  A place where they can check out books or read uh
556:  There's no such place.
Interviewer:  There wasn't? Well, I looked around today. Is there a library?
556:  Oh yeah. Fine library now. No such, no such thing in my day.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  You bought your books you wanted.
Interviewer:  And uh how about the railroad station? Uh is it known as uh right to be a train or?
556:  Depot.
Interviewer:  {D: That's a de-?}
556:  Yeah. Depot. Was quite a place in its day. We used to have a one time we had six passenger trains nearly everyday. And numerous freight trains. Course, back in those days a freight train wasn't so many cars. Now they put on just as many units as they want to. I saw a train a freight train coming the other day must've been two miles long. Had on five units. Each one of them was twenty-five hundred horsepower. And one one engineer had synchronized his throttle, so he could control all those engines with one throttle.
Interviewer:  Break that up, you get plenty
556:  Oh.
Interviewer:  Smoother.
556:  Well, you you'd see the old locomotive you take a sixty-car train with a steam engine, that was a pretty good train. And eighty cars were exceptional. That felt uh crowded. P-E-C crowded. Pull eighty cars crowded. Frame was called the rain road then But eighty cars, you never saw unless they were empty.
Interviewer:  The uh if you have uh a town of hotels X
556:  Yes, we had a always had a good hotel until it burned about two or three years ago. Had a fine hotel and cafe. It burned.
Interviewer:  {D: A place where your tailored coat uh.}
556:  That was a lyceum.
Interviewer:  Lyceum?
556:  Yeah, and they had one here. It built back well I remember the first show. The first traveling shows in the old lyceum. I remember my grandfather taking me in there. I couldn't have been over five years old. The lyceum. And by the way, that that that cut in that word lyceum was cut into marble. It stayed there. They tore that old building down. The post office is there now. That was where the lyceum stood. And they had many traveling traveling shows and musicals before the days of the movies course the movie knocked all that out of business.
Interviewer:  Can you talk about going to the theater or what or how was uh
556:  Going to the show.
Interviewer:  Going to the show?
556:  Yeah. It was in a theater, but this was called a lyceum.
Interviewer:  Lyceum. And if somebody had to carry something, it was very heavy. It was so heavy, you could hardly
556:  Lug it, tote it, pack it.
Interviewer:  Uh.
556:  Different terms for
Interviewer:  A person who sold something uh for less he paid for it so well it's it's real cheap, the person who's selling it had a
556:  What is that? A discount.
Interviewer:  Or a loss.
556:  Loss, yeah.
Interviewer:  Or on the other hand, if if the price was too high, somebody might say no I can't it it's uh
556:  Out of my reach.
Interviewer:  Out of your reach.
556:  Yeah, out of my reach. They're reaching too high.
Interviewer:  First day of the month, the bill would be
556:  Due.
Interviewer:  Uh and you paid the bill would you give uh give any merchant to somebody if somebody paid a large bill.
556:  Oh yeah. Yeah. Lagniappe
Interviewer:  Is that right?
556:  Uh lagniappe.
Interviewer:  And to one of those difficult things to {D: whistle} Uh that true? I don't believe I ever People remember but they can't remember the term.
556:  Lagniappe for sure. It's a lagniappe. Lagniappe uh that's very uh when you Well, I know at events, the niggers all the always they bought something, they they wanted lagniappe had to give 'em give 'em something.
Interviewer:  Would they use that word?
556:  Well, they didn't not possibly not, but they'd always hold out their hand you know just yeah they knew the system alright. They'd buy something, you'd have to buy them a stick of candy or a cookie or something, you know. But lagniappe was they expected a lagniappe go ahead and trade five hundred dollars a man paid it by give it past due I remember the first set of clothes I ever bought, you know. Back in my day, putting on long pants was quite an event in a boy's life. So I decided one day after school ended in June that I was gonna put on long pants in September. So I worked the whole summer trotting down to this clothing store decided the night and gave the fellow two or three dollars. And finally one day he said well you've got enough now for your suit. Don't know what I paid him for it. So I went down to get the suit, and he got the suit and he threw in a shirt, a neck tie, and a pair of socks. Lagniappe. But the socks was only ten cents a pair then. And the shirt was fifty cents. And the tie was a quarter, so. Wasn't so much a lagniappe.
Interviewer:  {X} if you bring {X} if you bring somebody whoever it be, {X} if a sister {X} his grandfather had something his grandfather used to give. It was a very handsome uh piece uh with his merchant's name {X}
556:  Yeah. Well they had they had things like that that's I have something down at the museum now. A hardware merchant gave her a little bank in the shape of a pig. Piggy bank. Pay your bill, he'd give you a piggy bank. Different things like that. You, just little things.
Interviewer:  You ever hear that uh called {X}
556:  No.
Interviewer:  {X} delighted to uh that was a custom and it was widely uh widely
556:  Pretty widely used. Uh this is uh Up until a few years ago there's the man had a store had a store sign in front of his store and he'd say each time you'd pay your bill, he'd uh draw you a Coca Cola lagniappe. Always gives you free but no matter what the bill was. Two dollars, three dollars, or fifty dollars you'd always have a Coca Cola. Do it in a glass, you know.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. You said that yesterday that a customer's still uh
556:  No, it's the beautiful old customers died about died out now.
Interviewer:  Uh, if you didn't have money, you'd go to somebody and try to
556:  Try to get credit.
Interviewer:  Credit uh
556:  Trust me till so-and-so.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. If they used the term borrow, how would they say it?
556:  Borrow.
Interviewer:  Loan, uh.
556:  Loan. Uh take a loan. Loan it to so-and-so. Want to borrow so much.
Interviewer:  And if you asked somebody for money, they say no, I'm sorry, money today is so
556:  Money is scarce. Hard to get. Money is scarce or tight. Money is tight. I heard 'em use that word. Money is tight.
Interviewer:  Was tight. If somebody uh had money but he was uh reluctant to ever uh give it away, he was known as a
556:  As a miser. Or stingy or words to that effect.
Interviewer:  Tight wad.
556:  Tight wad. That was a good word. Yeah, I told you about the old man around the church up there. Uh, near the church. We called his still grab-all because he grabbed everything he could get. Grab-all.
Interviewer:  Go ahead and on the table uh how would people talk X church or the whole community?
556:  Finally the whole thing got to being known as grab-all. Fact, in fact I didn't the the right name of the church was Bethesda. But that place was known as grab-all the whole time I was growing up. Where are you going to church next Sunday? Going to grab-all.
Interviewer:  It became known in the community.
556:  The story long since these exist burned down and the that old man was gone, but they still called it grab-all. Fact, they still do. Still referred by some of the people. It's still called grab-all. Like they say country settlement it's the proper name is Prairie Point, but everybody calls it Ho Guy.
Interviewer:  {X}
556:  Well, it how it got the name, I don't know. But it's Ho Guy. {NW}
Interviewer:  And uh the if if you uh a woman wore a dress and you were raised in X, that'd be paired or take home.
556:  They wrapped it in in uh paper. With string around it. Just lay it on the counter, fold it up, tear a piece of paper off the roll and rip it off. Put a string around it.
Interviewer:  And uh the term fetch and kempt and by and X those you'd say a fetch be
556:  Yeah, still use it. My daddy always hauled his he'd ever kill a bird, he'd haul it to his dog and say fetch! That dog knew what he meant. Say fetch, the dog'd go pick up the dead bird and bring it.
Interviewer:  Would go to the name, place, offer to go fetch it.
556:  Oh yeah, he'd fetch it. Yeah, that's it's it's still used.
Interviewer:  Still uh.
556:  Yeah.
Interviewer:  {D: Saw him The uh the place where the X}
556:  I was gonna say the niggers use another word fotch.
Interviewer:  Fotch.
556:  He fotch it to me.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. That
556:  Fetch. Past-tense of fetch, fotch.
Interviewer:  Oh, I see.
556:  He fotch it. Yeah, that he still use that all the time. Fotch.
Interviewer:  Fotch.
556:  Fotch. Uh yeah. He fotch it to me.
Interviewer:  And uh did the {X} elements in those days {X}?
556:  There was a county seat.
Interviewer:  County seat. Always?
556:  Yeah, always a county seat. Not sight. Move the seat.
Interviewer:  People uh talk about X day were those words used X ten speech somebody said it, used that phrase.
556:  Well they they were put into law-abiding towns. Uh but law and order I course the lawyers used that term. I heard many lawyers use that term law and order. They referred to it all the time, law and order.
Interviewer:  When {NW} man was executed, uh a noose was used.
556:  He was hung.
Interviewer:  How, uh?
556:  Uh, it's yeah.
Interviewer:  And
556:  For anything. There was a colored man out here on Mr. Sam {B} crazy killed his wife. In fact, he took a ax and cut her head open. He held his foot on her body and cut her head open. Several licks. And he was trying to term a court here, and they were taking him over to the old jail. Mr. {B} he worked for a guy who got late. And his name was Sam. He says Sam, have you had the trial? Said yes. Said what they gonna do to you? He said Mr. {NS} gonna hang me. Said I wouldn't mind being sent to the penitentiary for life. Said I sure do despise to be hung. He actually said that. He sure do. Despise to be hung. {NW} But they hung him.
Interviewer:  So is he {X}
556:  Uh, I despise to be hung.
Interviewer:  {X} reads to times of the day. What were those?
556:  Oh lord. The Indians had one word. They're better off than we are. The Indians had one word. {D: Autotone.}
Interviewer:  Oh?
556:  When Indians said aw that's morning, it's good morning. In the afternoon, it's good afternoon. If you leave or leave, it's goodbye. And if it's at night, it's good night. But they had one word. While we have all these hello, hi, how's tricks, how's everything, all that stuff.
Interviewer:  Uh they time of day you you change
556:  That's the afternoon.
Interviewer:  {X}
556:  Yeah, and there's so many people who don't know. It gets 'em confused.
Interviewer:  Right
556:  Southern people always use the evening for after lunch, after dinner.
Interviewer:  That's still pretty much why
556:  Yeah, yeah, they still use the evening means afternoon.
Interviewer:  And uh to to uh met a good a good friend and {X} be you met someone for the first time, what would your formal greeting be?
556:  #1 Well, the form #
Interviewer:  #2 And again, I'm thinking about the old days here. #
556:  Well, they they used to say I'm glad to make you acquaintance.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  That was the old that's of course today it's I'm please to meet you. I'm glad to know you, but it's I'm glad to make your acquaintance.
Interviewer:  Did did they say how do you do or how how you doing?
556:  Howdy.
Interviewer:  Howdy, uh.
556:  Howdy.
Interviewer:  But uh that would be uh that would be a less formal way. Howdy.
556:  Yeah, howdy.
Interviewer:  Uh would you duplicate {X} you and conversations {X}
556:  Hiya.
Interviewer:  Just so that in other words, it really doesn't have meaning, does it? It's just tone of voice.
556:  Hiya.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  That's it.
Interviewer:  It's friendly.
556:  #1 Yeah, hiya. #
Interviewer:  #2 Establishes #
556:  Hiya.
Interviewer:  Friendly.
556:  {D: Yes, slurry.}
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. #1 And people uh some someone like this shops all the time uh you all come back is that something that's known or uh do you say that do you #
556:  #2 Yeah. # Oh yeah. Y'all come. That was it was y'all come.
Interviewer:  Y'all come.
556:  Y'all come.
Interviewer:  #1 Or if uh it's children or young people and uh X a service station y'all come back that's #
556:  #2 Yeah. # Especially good today. Y'all come back.
Interviewer:  How how would they say again? Again or again?
556:  It's again. Again.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Not again.
Interviewer:  And how about the greetings for Christmas and New Years? They're called
556:  Well, that's just about the same right then as it was now. Merry Christmas. Happy New Year.
Interviewer:  Did you say Christmas gift?
556:  Well Now that was an expression that started with niggers. If they met the first time they met you on Christmas morning, they hollered Christmas gift, you had to give 'em something. And if you if you said it first, though, whichever one said it first got the gift, see?
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  They were very X catch you first.
Interviewer:  But uh Christmas X morgans X say or
556:  #1 Oh yeah. #
Interviewer:  #2 Christmas gift. #
556:  Only among friends.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  I remember the niggers would come to the house. It would be dark. Wouldn't even know they were there, and you'd walk out and then Christmas gift, Christmas gift! They all they what do you call they caught you.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  {D: Say they caught you.}
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  And of course you had to get some give 'em candy or cake or something. #1 They caught you. They caught you. They called it I caught you Christmas, see? I caught you Christmas. Well, they did. They said it first. #
Interviewer:  #2 I caught you Christmas. # And uh if uh this is the minute hand {NW} and this the hour hand, this would be a quarter
556:  It's a quarter to eleven.
Interviewer:  And this uh the minute hand.
556:  That's eight thirty.
Interviewer:  Or half?
556:  Half past eight.
Interviewer:  Half past eight.
556:  Yeah, it's half past eight.
Interviewer:  Uh. How bout the use of uh the sun? You had to get up before
556:  Oh, by the sun.
Interviewer:  Uh.
556:  By uh the by the sun. Or by sun up. Oughta see you sun up.
Interviewer:  Was that before
556:  Before sun down. And did you know that many of 'em can look at the sun and tell you the time to by golly we we had no {X} They would get they didn't own a watch need a watch. And he could look up at the sun and come within just a few minutes tell you what time it was. No matter what time of day it was. Look at the sun. Tell me right. He wouldn't miss it but a few minutes. I thought that was a marvelous thing. Way he could tell the time by looking at the sun. He'd look up there and go {X}
Interviewer:  Any time of the year?
556:  Yeah, he could tell you. They didn't need no watch, all he had to do is look at the sun, he said.
Interviewer:  We talked about uh paying bills, and I have to ask you do people go trading or shopping?
556:  Well Back in the old days, the farmer always took something to town to trade, see? I was talking to a farmer just yesterday. He runs a story in town to talk about the high prices of everything. Oh, he says, I remember back in the old days my mother she'd say uh Go out and gather up some eggs, go around the store, and get me a bar of soap and this, that, and the other. Gather the eggs and take 'em. Said I'd go out to the chicken house and get all the eggs maybe three or four dozen eggs take 'em and trade the eggs. We never had any money. We traded something with the store. Eggs, butter, or something. And said I she'd say gather up the eggs and go get me a cake or soap or whatever she wanted. And he said he'd go out and get ten cents a dozen except for the eggs and trade.
Interviewer:  Pass.
556:  Yes, there he was out yesterday. He saw me and told me egg yeah beaters Forty-nine cents a dozen and fifty-nine. That's a lot of difference. Oh yeah. Said I know it so well. Mother would say go out to the store. Gather up the eggs and go out to the store. Something different.
Interviewer:  And that was trading?
556:  That was trading.
Interviewer:  And would town people uh I guess take that term?
556:  Well, they had nothing to trade, so they had to buy.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. But would they still say I'm gonna trade?
556:  I trade with so-and-so.
Interviewer:  Trade with so-and-so.
556:  They'd say I what's who do you trade with? I trade with so-and-so's store. Yeah, still they had still say it.
Interviewer:  Our different terms for time. Uh how about the X say well, I can't see you a week from now because because somebody's coming. What's another way of saying next Wednesday? Or next Saturday? A week from Saturday. I get again say come Saturday
556:  Yeah, Saturday week's quite an expression.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Uh now the niggers use the term. They use it altogether. They would say the second Saturday or the third Saturday or the or the third Saturday before the first uh before the first Sunday. And they it's the darndest thing and they that's they way they expressed it. Now, I when I used to live up there in the country, see the the niggers they they just one day for Christmas, that was no good. Say it's Christmas here on Sunday. The next day would be the first Monday of Christmas, the first Tuesday, that whole week. It'd be the first Monday, first Tuesday, on, and the next week, it'd start over again. The second Sunday into Christmas, second Monday into Christmas.
Interviewer:  Into?
556:  Lasted about two weeks.
Interviewer:  Months?
556:  Into Christmas.
Interviewer:  Mm.
556:  First Sunday into Christmas. Second Sunday into Christmas. First Monday into Christmas. In other words, around around stretched around about two weeks.
Interviewer:  That's
556:  Of course they had to take get off that time. You know not to work.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  Had to be off then.
Interviewer:  The uh reason for
556:  To celebrate the whole couple weeks.
Interviewer:  Uh, different terms regarding the weather. You'd say the uh the daylight today is is mighty
556:  Mighty fine.
Interviewer:  Uh.
556:  Mighty hot but mighty fine weather.
Interviewer:  You look up uh at a stormy sky, and you say it's looking black uh making me nervous uh. You need any uh any particular words?
556:  Well they had cutter clouds and clabber clouds.
Interviewer:  Mm-hmm
556:  Yeah, they talked about cutter clouds. I don't know what kind
Interviewer:  X clabber?
556:  Clabber clouds. Clabber clouds looked like clabber. You know a lot of 'em could tell you looking at clouds what they weather was gonna be.
Interviewer:  Uh, what were the expressions they'd look up and they'd say uh I think the weather's uh pretty fair, but weather's uh
556:  Sure enough.
Interviewer:  Yeah?
556:  Sure enough bad.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh. And uh or it was getting stormy, you might say well, I think it's time the weather
556:  Break.
Interviewer:  Break? And the wind's been down that's starting to blow, you say well, the wind is
556:  Rising.
Interviewer:  Well, the reverse. Uh, the wind has been blowing hard, but it's
556:  Going down.
Interviewer:  Uh, and different kinds of words for rain uh something that just settles the dust
556:  Yeah that's. Well, you know they had different ways. They had chunk movers. That's a hard rain.
Interviewer:  Now that's a new one.
556:  Chunk mover.
Interviewer:  Chunk mover.
556:  And a gully washer.
Interviewer:  That I hadn't seen.
556:  Now, that's a hard rain. A gully washer chunk mover and a gully washer. That's hard rain.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  You look at the river that is full of chunks, you know? Heh.
Interviewer:  I see.
556:  It rises and peaks. That's a chunk mover we had last night. Or a gully washer. Yeah, that's
Interviewer:  Uh, X rain or not so much?
556:  We called it a seize. We had a good seize last night.
Interviewer:  Uh, what would be a drizzle or a shower, was that the same or?
556:  About the same. A drizzle was just a small shower. Shower was a pretty good rain.
Interviewer:  The uh did they used to refer to electrical storms or what else how did they used to or the storm would go under like?
556:  Well that they'd call it a thunderstorm.
Interviewer:  A day that is uh it's say November. It's cold.
556:  #1 Cold as flusions. Did you ever hear that word? #
Interviewer:  #2 No, I didn't. #
556:  Cold as flusions whatever fly I ever heard find out what flusions were, but I've heard it a thousand times. Cold as flusions today. Whatever that meant. I
Interviewer:  Or uh cold and uh cloudy and rainy. It's sometimes it's what kind of day?
556:  I've heard it referred to as foul weather.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Foul. Or lousy. It's a lousy day.
Interviewer:  You step outside and uh in the morning you've been shivering you say well this morning is mighty
556:  Uh. If it was cold?
Interviewer:  X
556:  Well, they'd refer to a lot of days as overcoat weather.
Interviewer:  Overcoat?
556:  Yeah, they'd say we got overcoat weather today.
Interviewer:  Would they say airish?
556:  Yeah, quite airish. I've heard that term and still use it. I still use that. Airish.
Interviewer:  #1 Now does that uh mean windy or cold or? #
556:  #2 Windy. # Cold wind.
Interviewer:  Cold wind.
556:  It's airish, it means there's cold wind.
Interviewer:  And uh the a long period, say two weeks, without rain, very hot
556:  Dry drought.
Interviewer:  Alright a long say a whole summer uh without a bit of rain
556:  Now, that's a dry drought. {NW}
Interviewer:  The uh wet stuff on the the plants in the morning.
556:  Dew.
Interviewer:  Uh, and if it freezes, it's. If it's cold enough to turn the dew white.
556:  #1 Yeah, frost. #
Interviewer:  #2 Frost? # And uh if you uh the white stuff the cloudy stuff uh in the road that makes it very hard to drive.
556:  Snow? Ice?
Interviewer:  Or or it's cloudy, filmy
556:  Fog.
Interviewer:  Or any term that you remember fog, dew, frost. How bout uh if a pond uh or small body of water has it freezes over just a slight.
556:  That's skim of ice.
Interviewer:  That's skim of ice?
556:  That's skim.
Interviewer:  I see. X much ice.
556:  No, not much. It was either no but it's skim of ice. That's quite a common {D: phrase. That was skim of ice.}
Interviewer:  A uh picking up mush ice.
556:  Yeah, well I they used mush ice for the lawn, they do.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Why they have it.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  We don't have much mush ice. That's when it's just salt and mush is.
Interviewer:  Freezes farther down.
556:  Yeah.
Interviewer:  Uh. Let's see. The uh I see in the hall that you are under a one of the things that I wanted to check.
556:  {D: I I'll have to take you I have a fifth to lure in my room.}
Interviewer:  Is that right?
556:  A fifth. That's what my wife tells me. Yeah. That's the governor of Georgia. Last three governors of Georgia.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  They were currently on his staff. I have a number of those things scattered around.
Interviewer:  And uh it's one of the things to uh to check on. An honorary commission.
556:  Yeah. Honorary kind of on the governor's staff of Mississippi, the governor of Georgia and Arkansas and High private into Tennessee militia. All of these are confirmed by the governor. {NS} I have the keys to the city of New Orleans, a golden key to New Orleans and Birmingham and I believe Little Rock, Arkansas. And some kind of honors from the city of Memphis. They all out on the wall.
Interviewer:  Uh, other ranks in the army.
556:  Yeah, I was a s- In World War one, I was a radio operator. Used to what you'd call a private in the army.
Interviewer:  Uh and uh ever hear this word captain uh in the army is a mission uh you ever hear it outside the army?
556:  Captain?
Interviewer:  Yeah.
556:  Oh yeah. That that's that that's the title they had. Title of respect you give to some old man. Captain. Captain A's. Not captain. Captain.
Interviewer:  #1 Would the wife uh use it for wife or? X #
556:  #2 Yeah. #
Interviewer:  Term he.
556:  #1 Well, when the niggers still refer to a man, he'll call him captain. Or say captain, can you tell me where so-and-so is? They still say. #
Interviewer:  #2 With respect. #
556:  Yeah. They still say it. When they want something. You know, when they want something. {NS} Captain.
Interviewer:  And uh what were these the Southern states as you learned them as a boy? Or what did you consider to be the South. Would you uh say?
556:  Anything below the Mason-Dixon line, I guess.
Interviewer:  Is that right?
556:  Yeah.
Interviewer:  Would you uh try to duplicate the X set for example it isn't Mississippi. Mississippi, right?
556:  Mississippi.
Interviewer:  And uh it isn't Tennessee, it's tennis
556:  Tennessee. Missi- They don't string out Mississippi. They call it miss Mississippi.
Interviewer:  Mississippi.
556:  Mississippi. Whereas it should be Mississippi.
Interviewer:  #1 Not well spelled that way #
556:  #2 Yeah. # That is too long. They oughta say Mississippi and let it go.
Interviewer:  Oh. We would try to duplicate the language associations with the other states' major cities.
556:  You mean the Southern states?
Interviewer:  Yes.
556:  Well, there's Georgia, and as they call it Georgie.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Louisiana. Louisiana. Not Louisiana. Louisiana. Alabama. South Carolina. North Carolina. Virginia. Arkansas. Arkansas now, not Arkansas Some of 'em say Arkansas. It's Arkansas.
Interviewer:  And uh by the way the Arkansas River X is you ever see it.
556:  Yeah, that's right.
Interviewer:  Or uh was Texas part of the South?
556:  Yeah, oh sure. Yeah. Texas. See, there was thirteen states in the Confederacy. Texas was one of 'em.
Interviewer:  So your sense of the South included Texas? Uh your feeling about the South included Texas?
556:  Oh sure.
Interviewer:  Lots of people tell me no, that's West.
556:  That's alright. Texas Texas was one of the Confederate states.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Course their governor Sam Houston was vilely opposed to it, but they passed their own reason. Passed it over and they seceded. Along with the other twelve states. Um, Texas was one of the original Confederate states.
Interviewer:  The major cities when you were as a boy?
556:  Memphis, Birmingham, New Orleans. By the way, the first time I I went to New York once. I heard a lady call it New Orleans. You never heard it called New Orleans what's she it's named after the province of Orleans in France. Of course, it is New Orleans, but it in New Orleans, you call it New Orleans.
Interviewer:  Mm-hmm.
556:  You know how they call it in New York. Memphis, Birmingham. Mobile, Little Rock. Jackson. Uh, Richmond. Charleston, Savannah, and so on.
Interviewer:  And you refer to the nation's capital. It was
556:  Washington.
Interviewer:  With the D.C., or?
556:  #1 Washington or well we said well we used to say Washington state when we meant the state of Washington. #
Interviewer:  #2 I see. #
556:  When you said Washington, you know you meant Washington, D.C.
Interviewer:  What about the city in southern Ohio on the river? X
556:  Which city?
Interviewer:  Uh, not Cincinnati and Louisville.
556:  Cincinnati and Louisville.
Interviewer:  Louisville.
556:  Louisville. That Louisville we see you're out of town Louis radius. Just twenty-five miles over here to Louisville, Mississippi And we said Louisville.
Interviewer:  Uh, you hear about Cincinnati?
556:  It is, yeah.
Interviewer:  How bout the state where St. Louis is? Where was that?
556:  Missouri.
Interviewer:  {X}
556:  Missouri.
Interviewer:  Which which sounds the way it used to be? Missouri or Missouri?
556:  Missouri.
Interviewer:  Missouri.
556:  Not Missouri. Missouri.
Interviewer:  {D: Uh. Couple of uh part of the South uh.}
556:  Well, it was more or less. They it never did formally secede, but they furnished many soldiers to the Confederacy. Hope your home would never uh well you'd take uh Kentucky. And uh Maryland never formally seceded, although they had half the men in in those states, half the men went to the federal army and half the Confederate army. And they're included in the Southern states because they're either had two legislations. One legislation voted to secede. The other voted not to. So for that reason and and so many soldiers from both states fought in the Confederate army that those they put those stars in the flag. They're included in the thirteen states. Although they never formally seceded or formally joined the Confederacy except on by the action of this {D: rump legislation.} And I'll have a many a boys from Kentucky and Maryland, both. Fought in the Southern army. Yeah.
Interviewer:  The uh the word that uh the words that you'd use for for pronunciations or all the words that you use for someone from a European countries studied geography in school, what would they be? Uh.
556:  Well, of course, a lot of these modern countries wasn't even there when I studied geography. We had England, France, and Germany. And Romania and Bulgaria and Russia. I guess Guess all these new, little countries been carved out since. Austria and Hungary.
Interviewer:  Let's see, you uh often mentioned Wales and Scotland and England. They uh mention Ireland
556:  Ireland?
Interviewer:  Yes, uh.
556:  {NW} Course, yeah that was a country. Ireland, Scotland, England, Wales.
Interviewer:  Uh you rarely find uh you can trace your ancestry say it goes back to Ireland.
556:  And millions of 'em came over here from Ireland. I know at the navy yard in New York, we had a bunch of Irish laborers. Playing uh uh drainage tiles. A whole bunch of big, old, husky Irishmen were doing that. Picking shovel work. They wasn't really Irish.
Interviewer:  You uh earlier mentioned down East what are all how did you study those states uh you say above New York?
556:  Well, we studied the New England states as uh up East. All the states.
Interviewer:  And the states were uh the state where lost East what
556:  Massachusetts.
Interviewer:  Would you say it again?
556:  Massachusetts.
Interviewer:  Uh-huh.
556:  Of course. Massachusetts, Massachusetts if you wanted to say it correctly. We we slurred it over and called it Massachusetts.
Interviewer:  I think that you know you ever you ever checked the pronunciations that only say it as Massachusetts. Uh say the ch. It's interesting it occurs there and occurs often. It's familiar it's all Massachusetts.
556:  They don't say the chu, huh?
Interviewer:  No, they don't.
556:  Massachusetts.
Interviewer:  Yes.
556:  Well, I tell you I went to school up in New York state, and it's never called that at all. No, it's Mass. Pittsfield, Mass, Boston, Mass. You know, they never They never pronounced the whole name. It's Mass. Pittsfield, Mass, and I went to school as a boy. Pittsfield, Mass. {NS} Like Poughkeepsie, New York. I up there they don't spell it out. They spell it P-O-K-P-S-I-E. Whereas it's Pough. Nobody's up there ever spelled it out. P-O-K-P-S-I-E.
Interviewer:  It's near uh by the way the the cough drops when you were there.
556:  Smith Brothers' cough drops, yes sir. Smith Brothers' cough drops or Smith has a very fine restaurant there. And the same old steam-driven fans or in that blew up there a few years ago and I we were in New Jersey up to see our daughter. And I I said let's drive up to Poughkeepsie. I wanna see the old place. So I went up there and lo and behold, all these new highways I just got lost and befuddled. But Smith Brothers, and I said let's go to Smith Brothers restaurant. I want to go there. And I had a roll of Confederate money and I took a roll of Confederate money with me. And we went at old Smith Brothers restaurant, and it was still there. Going strong. And when I got through, I tipped the waitress a five dollar Confederate bill, and she was just enthralled with it. And I went and paid the check to the cashier, the girls found me outside, said give me one of those bills that you gave the waitress. I would be delighted to have one. I pulled out the roll and handed her a ten Oh, just charming. I take that roll of Confederate money, and I use it for tips. Parking lots. {NW} Well, I got by beautifully with that Confederate money. They uh they just ate it up.
Interviewer:  Uh. It's Hyde Park is a good area.
556:  Oh yeah, we went up to Hyde Park. Drove the bus home. Went up Saw the graves out in the yard. Home.
Interviewer:  You ride the
556:  {D: Yeah, they had us three of us arrive arrive Robert forge the Washington and Henry Hudson steamers.} Used to you could go round-trip to New York and back for a dollar and a half.
Interviewer:  On steamers?
556:  On the steamer. We all went out round-trip on it. I believe it was a dollar and a half. Wasn't much anyhow. I think it was a dollar and a half. The day those steamers. Uh, they were wonderful things. They could come flying into the wharf and hit the dock without they didn't use turbs, they just bore right in and tie 'em up, unload the passengers and freight, untie it now. We took a ride on and we had a course mask convention in New York, and we took a ride on one of 'em up sixty miles. Oh, did we go. Uh, a considerable distance. I forty, fifty miles. We took this Had twenty-five hundred horse matches. We shattered the boat. One trip was.
Interviewer:  X see the river or matter of fact, X railroad
556:  #1 Yeah, right up the track. #
Interviewer:  #2 Uh. #
556:  #1 #
Interviewer:  #2 #
556:  New York Central was on one side. And on the other side's what's that other? The New York Central was on the
Interviewer:  East?
556:  West. Probably.
Interviewer:  As a matter of fact, X I went to school in New York X called the uh
556:  Cornwall is the city right across from Poughkeepsie.
Interviewer:  Oh. X
556:  East shore. What did they call that road? I know they the one along one's this parallel. One across the river and one on this side. And that river flows over in one of the you to the automobile traffic, trucks, whatnot. Course the roads get so deep in snow, and he couldn't use 'em until he cleared off just get off the river. Up that ice they'd go. Wonderful highway but the straight ice about three or four feet deep. Old engine.
Interviewer:  Well, sir. It's uh almost five o'clock. I certainly uh X {NS} {NS}